Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 5 Dec 2023

Vol. 1047 No. 1

Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

I have lost count of the number of times I have asked the Taoiseach to ban rent increases; each time he has said "No". Despite rents soaring to unaffordable levels, the Taoiseach will not budge. Now, because of his refusal to act, runaway rents have hit an all-time high. The recent report of the Residential Tenancies Board, RTB, shows massive rent hikes over the last 12 months. New rents have increased by almost 12% in the last year. It is the highest annual rent hike since the RTB began recording these figures 15 years ago. The average new rent being charged across the State is €1,600. An average of €2,105 per month is being charged in Dublin. This is off the wall stuff and is not sustainable for any worker, family or young person.

Runaway rents have become almost normalised on the watch of the Government but there is nothing normal about hard-pressed renters being fleeced right, left and centre. There is nothing normal about levels of rent that keep going up and up. How are renters to build a good life as they fork out these extortionate rents? Most do not stand a chance of getting a mortgage deposit together; not a hope. Every month is another hammer blow to renters who want to own a home. They do all of the right things. They work hard, make cutbacks, scrimp and save but with each rent hike the dream of homeownership is pushed even farther away. Is it any wonder that homeownership has collapsed under this Government for a generation? It is no wonder that renters pack their bags for Australia and Canada; they are getting out of Dodge. Older renters approaching pension age are also caught up in this nightmare. They worry that their pension will not cover their rent. What an awful feeling it must be for someone who has worked hard all of their life, only to be left with this terrible uncertainty.

Families, workers and young people deserve and need affordable housing and rent. Yet the response of the Government has been to set affordable housing targets that are far too low and to miss those targets again and again. The Government tells us its housing plan is working but that claim does not stack up in the real world. Housing prices are up, homeownership is down, rents are through the roof and homelessness is at record levels. That is the Government's performance on housing and its repeated message to renters is "Do not look to us for real help; you are on your own". That will not wash any more. Renters need meaningful action now. The tax credit the Government provided is too low and it is being swallowed up by extortionate rent hikes. Without a ban on rent increases, this will keep happening.

Ní thagann aon deireadh le cíosanna ró-dhaor. Caithfidh an Rialtas cosc a chur ar arduithe cíosanna ar feadh trí bliana agus cíosanna a ghearradh trí cíos iomlán na míosa a chur ar ais i bpócaí cíosaithe. Renters are crying out to Government for help that will make an impact and a difference. Sinn Féin brings a motion before the Dáil tonight. It calls on the Government to do two things for renters. First, it calls on the Government to implement an emergency three-year ban on rent increases. Second, it calls on the Government to cut rents by putting a full month of rent back in the pockets of every private renter. Will the Government finally take these actions?

The Taoiseach

We have rent pressure zones in Ireland. We introduced them many years ago and the vast majority of people renting in Ireland are covered and protected by them. That means there are increases of between 0% and 4% per year. We have also introduced the rent tax credit and that is a big help for a lot of people.

Next year, it is €750 a year for a single person and €1,500 a year for a couple who are renting together. That, in many cases, is a month's rent back in renters' pockets. Deputy McDonald mentioned some figures that were out in the past couple of days. Those figures show that the average rent paid by somebody in Ireland in an existing tenancy is around €1,300 a month, which is per property, not per renter. It is obviously higher in Dublin and lower outside of Dublin and the major cities. The figures the Deputy specifically referred to relate to new tenancies. New tenancies are properties that are being put on the market and rented out for the first time. Where an existing tenancy is rolled over, the rent pressure zone continues to apply.

Rent pressure zones do not apply to properties being put on the market for the first time. The obvious difficulty with what Deputy McDonald proposes is that if one imposes a rent freeze on a property that is being rented for the first time, it only applies after it has been rented out. That is the difficulty with what the Deputy proposes. The problem that we see in imposing rent freezes for three years, which is Sinn Féin's policy, is that it would almost certainly reduce new supply. What we desperately need in Ireland is new supply of homes of all types, including homes for people to purchase, social housing and also homes for people to rent. Sinn Féin's policy would mean fewer properties being available for people to rent. That might be of benefit to people who are renting already but it would pull up the ladder on people who need to rent for the first time, for example, young people, students who are getting their first job, and new arrivals to this country such as nurses coming to work in our health service, or indeed people coming back from Australia, the UK and places they may have migrated to.

I have good news for Deputy McDonald when it comes to homeownership. We are seeing record numbers of first-time buyers. We have not seen the numbers of first-time buyers that we have seen recently for 16 years. About 500 first-time mortgages are being drawn down every week and about 400 people buy their first home. We have not seen that in 16 years. That is happening because of some of the policies that Government has put forward, including increasing housing supply, reducing the cost of building new homes by getting rid of development levies or suspending them, which Sinn Féin is opposed to, the help to buy scheme, which Sinn Féin is opposed to, giving people their taxes back to help with a deposit when they are buying a new home, and also schemes like first home. These are all things that Sinn Féin would take away from people and Deputy McDonald needs to be honest about that. Sinn Féin is not a party of homeownership. It wants to take away from people all the things that the Government has put in place to help people buy a first home.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

Homeownership has collapsed on the Taoiseach's watch. That is not just my opinion or view. I do not say that from a position of bias. That is the fact of the matter. We have runaway rent, record levels of homelessness, and rents that are crippling people. That is the fact. The figures that I have quoted to the Taoiseach are from the Residential Tenancies Board. It also reports that existing rents - not new rents but existing rents - are up by 5.5% in Dublin and 5% across the State. This is a bad news story all around. I am simply asking the Taoiseach to intervene at a time where he has to know how badly people are struggling. He has to know that if he lives in the real world at all. Families, workers and young people are really struggling to keep a roof over their heads. I am simply asking the Taoiseach to intervene and do a thing that is eminently sensible. For three years, make it the case that there can be no further increase in rents. Just ban rent increases for three years. It is common sense and it answers directly the experience, situation and hardship that so many families, workers and young people are experiencing now.

The Taoiseach

The Deputy says things with such a level of confidence that I would say many people actually believe her. Does she actually know the facts? The census states that in 2011, when I was first appointed to government, 1.15 million people owned their own home. In the last census, in 2022, 1.2 million people owned their own home. In raw numbers, more people owned their own home in 2022-----

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

It is the population.

Deputy Eoin Ó Broin

What is the proportion?

The Taoiseach

-----than was the case in 2011. Fair enough, the population has increased, so homeownership in the census in 2022-----

Deputy Eoin Ó Broin

As a percentage of housing stock, it has fallen. The Taoiseach knows that.

The Taoiseach

-----was 68.9% while in 2011, it was 70.4%. Is that really a collapse?

By the way, just in case the Deputy is not aware, percentages have to add up to 100. One of the reasons we have seen a change in numbers is because the percentage of people benefiting from social housing has gone up from 8.7% in 2011 to 10% in 2022.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

That is not true. Mathematical wizardry.

The Taoiseach

It is true.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please, Deputies.

The Taoiseach

It is in the actual census.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

Maths is not the Taoiseach's thing.

Deputy Simon Harris

Facts are not your thing.

The Taoiseach

Alternative facts.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will the Deputies calm down, please? Will the mass exodus from the Chamber be quiet as well?

Deputy Holly Cairns

How much longer is the international community going to sit back and watch an impending genocide in Gaza? How many innocent civilians have to die? How many children have to be butchered? How many hospitals have to be destroyed, residential buildings flattened, schools decimated and farms devastated? How much slaughter and indiscriminate destruction can western leaders stomach? More than 15,000 people have now been massacred in Gaza, including at least 6,000 children. Will 5,000 more Palestinian lives satisfy Israel's desire to seek revenge? Will it be 10,000, 20,000, or is there any number of Palestinian lives lost that is deemed unacceptable?

Nearly two months ago, Israel gave more than 1 million people just 24 hours to leave northern Gaza and then it destroyed everything in the north including hospitals, schools, apartment buildings and even refuge camps. Now, after a brief seven-day ceasefire, it has resumed its slaughter, except this time, its focus is in the south where more than 1 million displaced people were told to seek shelter. The depths of the depravity being unleased in Gaza is unprecedented in its scale and its brutality. Having told millions of civilians to flee to the south, Israel has now divided Gaza into a grid system of 600 blocks. Every day, it drops flyers in Gaza telling civilians which grids are about to be blown off the face of the earth, however the information can only be accessed through a QR code or social media posts. Gaza has been reduced to rubble. Its communication systems are in tatters. How many people have smart phones or Internet connections to check if they are about to be blown to bits?

This level of calculated and premeditated barbarism is disgusting. The fact that many western leaders are watching this, and are still refusing to directly criticise Israel, is despicable. What will it take for the international community to act? Is Israel free to unleash whatever hell it likes on more than 2 million people? Already civilians in Gaza have been murdered, mutilated, displaced, starved, and brutalised. They have all been denied all of the protections they are supposed to have under international humanitarian law. The Irish Government's words of condemnation have been stronger than most EU countries, but words are not enough. It is long past time for sanctions to be imposed on Israel. It is now three weeks since the Taoiseach told me he would get legal advice on whether Israel is in breach of the human rights clause in the EU-Israel trade agreement.

An Ceann Comhairle

Thank you, Deputy.

Deputy Holly Cairns

Has the Taoiseach done that? The next EU Council meeting is next Thursday. Will he be recommending sanctions on Israel at that meeting?

The Taoiseach

I thank the Deputy. I share her horror about what is continuing to unfold in Gaza. I do not think anyone could find the current situation to be anything more than unbearable, quite frankly, to see thousands of people being killed and thousands of children losing their lives. While Israel has the right to defend itself, the actions it has taken, in my view and that of the Government, are disproportionate and will ultimately be counterproductive. We know from history that when people are treated in that way, it strengthens their resolve. As the Americans have said in recent days, Israel might achieve a military victory but it is very likely to be a strategic defeat of its own long-term security.

I was glad to hear the American authorities use that language and put across that message.

As regards the questions the Deputy asked about Israel's actions in Gaza and the international community, I do not speak for Israel and I do not speak for the international community. I can speak only for the Irish Government, and our position is very clear: that there should be a new ceasefire, that that ceasefire should be an extended one if not a permanent one and that it should be observed by all sides, not just by Israel but also by Hamas, Islamic Jihad and the Palestinian militant groups that have committed and are committing terrible actions also.

We do not have the legal advice back yet. I have asked for it but I do not have it back yet. I hope to have it back soon.

As regards sanctions, I can only say what I have said before. Sanctions are effective only when they are done on a multilateral basis. I do not believe it would be the right thing for Ireland to engage in imposing unilateral sanctions. There would be a response. There would almost certainly be retaliation, not just from Israel but perhaps from others. That would create problems for us and disadvantages for our citizens and would not be effective in changing the mind of the Israeli Government. I think the Deputy knows that as well as I do. Sanctions can be effective only if they are done on a multilateral basis. We are one of the countries that is listened to on an international basis. I attended the COP in Dubai in recent days. I had a chance to speak to many representatives of countries from the Arab world and the global south. They recognise the position Ireland is taking as one of leadership within the European Union and recognise that we are not applying double standards in the way some countries are. If, however, we go out on a limb and take unilateral actions, we will be listened to less. It might make us feel better but it will not do any good for the Palestinian people.

Deputy Holly Cairns

The Taoiseach said he would get legal advice on the EU-Israel trade agreement three weeks ago. Where is the urgency when a child is dying every ten minutes in Gaza? People there cannot wait any longer. Whole families, generations of people, have been wiped off the face of the earth. People do not have enough food or water, they have nowhere to flee the bombs, most of the hospitals are not functional any more, and we are watching this happen without doing anything meaningful to try to stop it. Absolutely zero pressure is being applied to Israel. Netanyahu has been clear that the killing will continue until they say Hamas has been destroyed, but how will they measure that? We know their intelligence is not reliable and we know they engage in lies and misinformation to cover up their human rights abuses.

Israel has to face consequences. Ireland must advocate for that at an EU level. I recognise that going out on a limb and introducing EU sanctions is not something the Taoiseach can do. I am asking him to push for that at an EU level, at the next meeting, on Thursday, to try to get that unilateral response like we did with the war in Ukraine, to encourage the rest of the community in Europe to take those strong actions. I understand the Taoiseach's position and I agree with it, but the position of having only words of condemnation is what I cannot understand. We can do more to try to save lives and the Government is not doing it. We need actions to match those words. Where is the urgency?

The Taoiseach

We are doing a lot as a country on an international stage, and both the Tánaiste and I have been very active on this issue. When I met people from all over the world in Dubai in recent days, from the Arab world and from the global south in particular, they were very appreciative of and thankful for the Irish position, a position we have been taking, which is not one of double standards. That is something we will continue. We have done a lot of work to help our citizens to get out of Gaza, we have done a lot of work to make sure that humanitarian aid could get into Gaza, and we will continue that work.

I do take exception to the idea that there is something the Irish Government is not doing that would stop the killing in Gaza. I do not think that is a fair comment, if that is what the Deputy meant. It is almost trying to blame the Irish Government and the Irish people for the actions of Israel and-----

(Interruptions).

Deputy Róisín Shortall

No it is not.

The Taoiseach

If that is not what Deputy Cairns was trying to imply-----

Deputy Róisín Shortall

It was not. Do not suggest that.

The Taoiseach

-----then I thank Deputy Shortall for that clarification.

Deputy Michael Lowry

People across the country were outraged when they learned the inside secrets of RTÉ's operation. News of bonus payments and sponsorship perks were followed by acrimonious debate. It was clear that if RTÉ was to survive, decisive action and Government help was required. The Government approved a State bailout of €56 million subject to a number of stringent conditions.

As these Government discussions took place, they were closely observed by Independent Broadcasters of Ireland, IBI, the body that represents all 34 of the country's independent radio stations. These independent broadcasters provide an essential service to communities throughout the country. They are the information source for everything that happens locally and they keep people updated about important issues and events taking place where they live. Local radio is the preferred listening choice in homes throughout Ireland. They are structured in such a way that they bring local happenings into homes on a daily basis. Local radio is the bedrock of local communities.

Despite the vital and irreplaceable role of local radio, its news service is under threat. Local radio now finds itself in a constant battle against unregulated news sources online and on every social media platform available. The ability of local radio stations to be first out with local news and updates is being thwarted by unsolicited, and often ill-informed and unreliable, sources. They have no defence against this activity. They were given a glimmer of light with the recommendations contained in the report of the Future of Media Commission. These recommendations include the introduction of a pilot support scheme, known as the local democracy reporting scheme, which it was hoped would provide financial assistance in the coverage of local and European elections. Will the Taoiseach inform the House why this will not happen? This will negatively impact the scope of local radio to provide detailed, accurate and balanced coverage of the upcoming elections. It will also leave the door open for unregulated keyboard warriors to irresponsibly spread inaccurate and potentially dangerous information. We have recent evidence and examples of how wide-ranging this scope can be.

IBI has put forward a request for interim funding of €2.5 million to support its coverage of the 2024 elections. To assist in its ability to survive, it is also seeking parity in VAT with the print sector, which has had VAT slashed to 0%. In light of the anticipated €30 million media fund allocation, it is seeking an allocation of €5 million per annum specifically for news and current affairs. It is asking for the removal of the broadcasting levy. In essence, it seeks to be recognised and included in any new model of funding. It is vital that future funding be allocated in an equitable and fair manner. A total of 3.3 million people listen to local radio daily and 1,500 jobs are dependent on its survival. The clock is ticking for local radio and the Government would do well to tune into its problems.

The Taoiseach

I thank the Deputy for raising this very important issue. At a time of misinformation and disinformation, and at a time that is so often amplified online, the importance of quality media and public service broadcasting has never been so valid. That includes RTÉ and national media but also includes local media, including local broadcasters and newspapers, many of which employ a lot of people and many of which are struggling financially at the moment.

The Deputy mentioned the recommendation from the Future of Media Commission to establish a new media fund through which a wider range of outlets and platforms could be supported in the provision of public service content. A total of €6 million is being allocated in the budget, through the appropriations Bill that was approved by the Cabinet today, to establish this fund on an administrative basis. Priority is being given to two projects the Deputy mentioned. One is local democracy reporting and the other is courts reporting. Courts reporting will enable local media to cover what is going on in the District Court in particular in their own localities, and the local democracy reporting scheme will be there to cover what goes on, for example, at council meetings and other important local events. A total of €6 million has been allocated for this to be established next year.

The Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, and Coimisiún na Meán are developing these schemes. This has to be notified to the European Commission because there may be an issue with state aid and Government subsidies. We do not think this will be a big problem but because it involves a Government subsidy or Government state aid to private business it has to be done. Subject to state aid approval, these two new schemes will be in place in 2024 with a budget of €6 million to back them. We hope to have them in place, if at all possible, before the local and European elections next June.

Deputy Michael Lowry

I thank the Taoiseach for that very positive reply. This is an issue that I and my colleagues in the Regional Group have been putting forward on behalf of our local radio stations across the country. This allocation of funding will enable them to sustain their service, retain experienced, high-quality staff and recruit and train for the future. It will also allow them to further exploit their huge potential. Their message to the Government and to every Member of this House is that broadcasting is not all just about RTÉ. Just like RTÉ, independent radio is an asset that cannot be allowed to fail. Regarding Government policy, I am delighted the Cabinet made this decision today because it will provide relief from the financial burden these local radio stations currently endure.

The Taoiseach

I know independent broadcasters and Local Ireland have been briefing TDs and Senators from all parties. Indeed, they met a delegation from my own parliamentary party to discuss the situation only in the last two weeks. We are very keen to press ahead with this new funding of €6 million, the local democracy reporting fund and the courts reporting fund. This will be of particular benefit to local radio and local newspapers, which are struggling in the current environment, particularly when advertising revenues have fallen off and moved largely online.

As part of the wider reform of the TV licence fee, I think it is fair to say that any reform that is going to be meaningful, must be one that takes account of the fact that public service broadcasting is not just provided by RTÉ, although I think RTÉ does this very well, by the way, notwithstanding some of the issues it has had in recent months. What must also be taken into account is the fact that public service broadcasting is provided not just by RTÉ but also by local radio, local newspapers and the national independent media.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

The nitrates derogation reduction becomes a reality from 31 December, changing from 250 kg N/ha to 220 kg N/ha. This means we will have to slaughter 40,000 heavily-in-calf cows this coming year because there is no other market for them, and 160,000 in the next four years. Farmers will have reduced incomes, and smaller farmers will become unviable. Tim Herlihy, from Inches in Rathmore, has 58 cows now. He worked hard to bring his herd up to this figure. He has told me that his adviser has told him that he will have to reduce this number to 48. This is because he cannot rent or buy any more land, as it is too expensive.

This is the first time in history the farmers of Ireland have been compelled to cull their cows. If we do reduce production, it does not follow that consumers will reduce their consumption, unless the Government can organise a hunger strike worldwide. The consumers, though, will have to get their food somewhere else, and it does not matter to the Government whether it is from Brazil, Argentina or New Zealand. The Government does not mind as long as it can get the figures here down. But we are all under the same sky, so surely if we are talking about the climate and carbon emissions, then it should also matter if the other crowd are also increasing and creating more emissions.

Has the Government ever heard of such a thing as sequestration? The Government is telling the farmers of Ireland that it cannot measure the sequestration of carbon until 2027, or later. At the same time, however, the Government is hell-bent on reducing the cow numbers this year because Eamon Ryan wants it to and the members of the Government are under his apron. For the Taoiseach and for Micheál Martin to stay in power, as well as the rest of ye, they will sell the farmers of Ireland.

Do they know what is happening in the rest of the world? I had to go over to the USA for a couple of days last week for a funeral. There are the biggest of vehicles. There are roads over you, under you and up and down beside you with six lanes on all sides of you. All these vehicles, the biggest of vehicles, are all petrol; eight-litre petrol engines. Germany is mining new coal mines. China is building hundreds of coal-burning power stations. I certainly know you do not have to have AdBlue in India.

Turning to water quality, and surely this is what this is about, why is the Government not so interested in doing something about the hundreds of treatment plants in settlements around County Kerry, and areas around the country that have no treatment plant?

They are polluting the water.

If all of us evaporated from the country tonight, it would only make 0.13 of 1% of a difference worldwide. This is the torture the Government is putting the people through for the sake of Eamon Ryan and staying in power and for no other bloody reason. That is what you are at. It is driving the farmers and the people of Ireland down through the ground. That is what the Government thinks of them.

The Taoiseach

I thank the Deputy. It is important to put on the record of the House that the nitrates directive and derogation are environmental law and is about water quality above all. No matter what they do in America, India or China, and no matter what the Eamon Ryan thinks or does not think, all of us in the House want to have high quality waterways and rivers in our country.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

What about the sewers and treatment plants?

The Taoiseach

It is in the interests of urban and rural people, and farmers and non-farmers to have pristine and clean rivers and clean water in our country. Ultimately, that is what the nitrates directive and derogation is about. It is not about CO2 emissions or climate; it is about water quality. I am disappointed that we were not able to hold onto the 250 kg limit. We did our best to do so.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

He did not try because he sat at home.

The Taoiseach

The Minister, Deputy McConalogue, and I met the Commissioner and explored any possible flexibilities that we could get, including moving the date for implementation, but the rules are clear and are written in black and white in European law. We have some flexibilities. The average is not immediate from 1 January, but is over the period of the year so people can delay implementation. Obviously, that means doing more in the latter half of the year and the consequences that arise from that. It does not have to happen on 1 January; it is an average over a full year. There is the possibility of exporting slurry. There are other options available to farmers. As well as that, there are some changes to how calves are calculated in the directive and help for farmers was announced in the budget in terms of slurry storage and so on.

My biggest concern for Irish farmers and our food industry is the possibility that we will lose the derogation altogether in 2025. The Netherlands has already lost it. It is already gone in Flanders. Only Ireland and Denmark continue to have the derogation. I have a big concern that we will lose it altogether. If we lose it, we will be doing a big disservice to Irish farmers, farm incomes and our wider food industry. The worst thing we can do for farmers is to tell them that this problem is going to go away because it is not. We have to work together to improve our water quality. That means changes being made on farms. It also means improving Uisce Éireann's infrastructure and doing lots of other things. The last thing we can do now is to turn a blind eye or tell people this problem is going to go away. It is not. The way we keep the derogation we have is to improve our water quality and that means the Government and farmers working together to make sure that happens.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

The political point is that if we do not sell food from Ireland people will get it elsewhere. It is very clear to me that neither the Taoiseach, Micheál Martin or Charlie McConalogue put up any real fight to stop this. Consumers will have to get food. There are a million more people in Ireland. I hope the Government is not thinking of slaughtering some of them. I would not trust the Government if Eamon Ryan asked it to do it. The cow is the easy option.

What about the treatment plants? The Government is making no attempt in the world. This has been going on since I came up here in 2016. I and others in the House have raised this issue. There has been no difference or improvement. Kenmare is waiting. Currow and Scartaglen do not have any. Castleisland is waiting for an extension. It is an issue all over the county. Knocknagashel and Brosna do not have treatment plants. The waters are being polluted. What is the difference in polluting water from bad treatment plants? The Government has said the cattle are doing it, but I doubt that very much. Farmers are the first target.

Many young farmers will not take over farms because they cannot bear the villainisation and criticism farmers are getting. They are being blamed for the whole thing. Yet, we see what is happening in the rest of the world. No one else is doing what the Government is doing. Eamon Ryan has flown to COP or whatever.

He would want to get a bottle of cop-on somewhere because of the racket that is going on.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy, we are way over time now, please.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

He is spending two weeks in Dubai, where they do not give one tuppence about him because they will drill for oil, shove the land out into the sea and they will build cities, and we cannot build a house here because people cannot get planning permission to put a roof over their heads. That is what we have here.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy, you are on a roll. Taoiseach, please.

Deputy Ged Nash

A full minute over time. It is nonsense.

The Taoiseach

I do not like anyone being demonised when it comes to this debate. I do not like to see farmers being demonised, I do not like to see farmers being climate-shamed and I do not like to see my colleague, the Minister for the environment, Deputy Ryan, being demonised either. This is a European law-----

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

He is demonising farmers.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please.

The Taoiseach

-----agreed by 27 member states, and it has been around for quite some time, long before Eamon Ryan was a member of this Government.

I believe it is possible to produce high-quality food in this country and still have good water quality. That is actually what people in Ireland want, in rural and in urban communities. If we get a reputation for producing food in a way that is not sustainable, we will lose market share around the world. A total of 90% of the food we produce is for export, and we need to maintain that reputation for having sustainable agriculture and being genuine about the Origin Green concept, so it is in everyone's interest to get this right. Farmers want to keep the derogation, we want to keep our market share around the world and we also want to improve our water quality, which means the Government and farmers working together to make sure that happens between now and 2025. Yes, it involves investment in treatment plants, reducing industrial waste and changes on farm. If we do that, we will keep the derogation, but bear this in mind. To keep the derogation is a vote of 27 member states, most of which do not have the derogation and see it as a competitive advantage that we have, so we need to be clever about this. It does not involve slagging off Eamon Ryan. It means boxing clever and actually looking after the interests of farmers, and that means improving our water quality so that we can keep the derogation.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

Sitting on your backsides at home will not sort it out.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please, Deputy, please.