Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 20 Feb 2024

Vol. 1049 No. 7

Saincheisteanna Tráthúla - Topical Issue Debate

Schools Building Projects

Deputy Darren O'Rourke

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for selecting this important issue for the debate. There are many who will make the case for their local school building project to be progressed. That is understandable but it comes with the risk that all cases are heard at the same and all cases are treated the same. I am here to make the case that all cases are not the same. I believe the case of Lismullen National School is such that it deserves immediate and urgent attention and action.

Due to substandard, wholly inadequate accommodation, the 269 children who attend Lismullen National School are denied what we would all expect as the basics. The building is totally outdated; the external space is similarly inadequate. Students are accommodated in small, cramped rooms. The original building was built in 1959, 65 years ago; the new building, so-called, was opened in 1992, 32 years ago; and prefabs, many more than 20 years old, make up the rest. This has a huge impact on teaching and learning for children and the work environment for staff and management.

I will touch on a couple of aspects. The first is heat. The building is so cold that the heating goes on at 4 a.m. to heat the rooms. The vast majority of that heat goes out the paper-thin windows, walls and roof. Staff and children are regularly forced to wear coats and hats during the day. The second is power. The fuseboard is overloaded and regularly trips. That means that children are denied the usual ICT experience. They cannot store the materials anyway because there is not enough space. On space, there is no indoor space to gather as a school community for school assembly or sports. That means there is no PE in winter. They cannot complete the dance or gymnastic strands of the PE curriculum. They cannot have Christmas plays, music and drama or events that ordinarily include an audience. The school simply cannot conduct them. There is no space internally or, to a large extent, externally for sports. This has an impact on the physical development and the health of the student population.

Children with additional educational needs do not have space for movement breaks. There are no sensory gardens not to mention occupational therapy or physiotherapy. The group for sustainability cannot happen anymore. The buddy benches are not being used for their purpose due to overcrowding. There was a discussion earlier about the school hot meals programme. Such are the constraints in this school because there is no access to facilities to heat the food that they need to have a supplier who brings the food already hot. That is a significant constraint on the number of options for suppliers.

Staff are doing their absolute best in everything they are doing for the children but morale is dreadfully low. They have one toilet for 25 staff. They are working in the cold. Like parents, they see no light on the horizon.

This is wholly inadequate accommodation for a primary school in 2024. It is wrong. It is as simple as that. The most recent response from the Department was on 23 January. It said there was a preferred bidder identified and the Department would be in contact with the school and the design team in relation to the progression of the project. That was almost a month ago. The school population is watching on tonight. They want to know when this project will get the green light and when a letter of authorisation will issue.

Minister of State at the Department of Education (Deputy Josepha Madigan)

I thank the Deputy for raising this matter as it provides me with the opportunity, on behalf of the Department of Education, to outline to the Dáil the current position in relation to the large scale capital building project for Lismullen National School, County Meath. I am answering this question on behalf of the Minister, Deputy Foley.

This project is included in the Department of Education’s construction programme which will be delivered under the national development plan as part of Project Ireland 2040 framework. The Department’s planning and building unit is currently assessing its work programme and priorities for 2024 in the context of overall requirements. Lismullen National School remains a priority for delivery, in line with the accommodation issues present at the school. The tender process was undertaken and a contractor identified. The next steps for this project will be the completion of the tender process and progression to stage 4, which is construction.

I want to reassure the Deputy and the Lismullen National School community that the school building project will be progressed and delivered. The Department will update the school authorities when there is a further update on the progression of the major project.

The project brief for the project at Lismullen National School includes the construction of a 16-classroom primary school and the demolition of the existing school building. The next step is that the project is at an advanced stage of architectural planning, stage 3, tender action and award and the next step in the process will be the authorisation to issue the letter of intent to the contractor. The officials are determining the best timeline for proceeding to construction. When the project commences on site, there will be an estimated 20-months contract duration.

The timeline on this is as follows. In December 2011, the design team for this project was appointed. In January 2012, the project was authorised to progress to stage 2a, which is the developed sketch design stage. Then in February 2013, the project completed stage 2a and was authorised to proceed to stage 2b, which is the detailed design and which includes securing statutory approvals and preparation of tender documents. It then went to the phasing strategy, which was developed in detail by the design team, and then the planning permission application for the temporary accommodation was lodged with Meath County Council in January 2019.

Following a request for further information from Meath County Council, the planning was granted in August 2019. At that point, the design team was working on the completion of the stage 2b report, which requires the inclusion of a near-zero energy building in compliance with the 2017 amendment to part L of the current building regulations. The stage 2b report was received in February 2021 for the Department’s review and approval. Then on 10 May 2021 the Department issued stage 2b comments to the school and design team for its intention. On 28 March 2022, the pre-qualification final shortlist was received in the Department from the design team leader. On 8 April 2022, a final stage 2b approval letter was issued to the school and design team, approving the stage 2b design and approval to proceed to tender stage.

On 1 July 2022, incomplete tender submissions were received by the design team. On 20 July 2022, the design team, in consultation with the Department issued approval for the school to proceed with the open tender procedure. In October 2022, the extension of time granted to the tender return date to facilitate contractors interested in tendering saw a new tender return date of the end of October 2022. In January 2023, clarifications were requested on the tender report received by the Department and the tenderer subsequently withdrew. Then we went to May 2023 up to January 2024, as the Deputy mentioned.

The reason I outlined that is to show the Deputy that all along there has been progress at every different stage and that it is progressing.

Deputy Darren O'Rourke

I must say there will be real disappointment. The Minister of State’s contribution is a saga, from the perspective of the students, parents and staff. This school was first accepted onto the list of new school builds in 2007. Parents whom I met last night could point to other school buildings that went on at the same time or even eight years later and have progressed to completion or almost completion at this stage. There is huge frustration at the rate of progress here.

The school population want to hear from the Minister of State and it is welcome that she says it is a priority but they want a clear timeline and a clear indication of the date on which the letter of intent will issue. They have had the real disappointment of a contractor pulling out in the past and there is understandable concern that this will happen again. This is an horizon that is always just a step away. This is a very proud school and the whole community is doing its level best but it is not working with facilities that are suitable in this day and age in 2024. They are looking to the Minister of State, to the senior Minister, to the Department and to their local Government representatives for a clear date on which the letter of intent will issue and the giving of that green light to this project after many, many false dawns.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Deputy and I understand his frustration. However, having read this brief myself on the progress that is there, one can quite clearly see that there is a chronological timeline. I note that there was a planning permission which lapsed at one point, a new planning application was made to Meath County Council in July 2023 and the final grant of planning was received in October 2023. As the Deputy has pointed out there and as I said earlier, it is on the priority list. The fact that I am in the Dáil Chamber here today answering the Deputy's Topical Issue question will bring attention to this matter and I have no doubt that it would be done as soon as possible.

The Deputy will appreciate that since 2020, the Department of Education has invested in the region of €4.3 billion in schools throughout the country involving the completion of over 800 school building projects with construction currently under way at approximately 300 other school projects, which includes 34 new school buildings. I will bring this matter to the attention of the senior Minister for the Deputy.

Road Projects

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

This is to discuss the long-awaited N22 Killarney bypass from Lissyviggeen to Farranfore and from Lissyviggeen to Castlelough on the Muckross Road, the N70, and that this be prioritised to be progressed in this year's programme.

I attended the Oireachtas transport committee last Wednesday evening and when I asked Peter Walsh, a senior official of Transport Infrastructure Ireland, TII, whether this project was on the programme, I learned from him that it was not on the national development plan for 2024. To say the least, the people of Kerry are very disappointed with this utterance from this man. It is in this context that I am raising this issue with the Minister of State again tonight. Many people are disappointed, including Kerry County Council and the TII officials locally in Kerry who have been trying to progress this scheme for many years.

This scheme, the Killarney bypass, has been on the table for 24 years since 2000. A route was selected in 2004 and was presented to the public in the Great Southern Hotel in that year. It was dropped because of the downturn in 2008 until I started raising it again here in the House when I was elected around 2016. Because of the delay, TII decided that it should go out for public consultation again, identifying four new possible routes in 2021 and one was to be selected in April 2022.

Councillor Maura Healy-Rae raised this issue again last Monday with Kerry County Council and the reply given by the council was that the N22 Farranfore to Killarney scheme was at phase 2, options, selection stage. The draft options selection report was peer-reviewed by Transport Infrastructure Ireland in October 2022 and TII requested that additional work, including the further appraisal of all tenders, including combinations of road and non-road solutions, active travel and public transport modes which could potentially meet the scheme objectives and confirm the Climate Action Plan 2023 requirements be undertaken. This was ordained by the Minister for Transport, Deputy Eamon Ryan. TII allocations are awaited and will determine whether the option selection phase can be completed or not in 2024.

In addition, Kerry County Council have procured consultants to prepare an area-based transport assessment for Killarney and work is under way. Some €500 million to €800 million is required to allow this project to go ahead, to allow for the planning and development of our county and to assist our tourism, industry, commercial transport and, indeed, farming. Our town of Killarney has been clogged for the past number of summers, evening after evening. Above all, this is for the safety of all who use this road. There are 24,000 vehicular movements daily, six dangerous junctions intersecting on this current N22 primary road, and many lives have been lost here.

To give back the unwanted three routes to landowners who have had their land effectively sterilised for many years, I am appealing to the two Kerry Government TDs, Deputy Griffin and the Minister, Deputy Foley, to use their influence at this critical and crucial time. This is their time; this is our time. When Jackie Healy-Rae was in the position he held and when the Government was depending upon him, he used his influence. I am asking those two Deputies to use their influence now to ensure that we get for the people of Kerry what they rightfully deserve.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Deputy for raising this very important project for Kerry and its environs. I am, obviously, answering this question on behalf of the Minister for Transport who has responsibility for overall policy and Exchequer funding for the national roads programme. Once funding arrangements have been put in place with TII, which is mentioned by the Deputy, under the Roads Acts and in line with the national development plan, the planning, design, improvement and upgrading of individual national roads is a matter for TII, in conjunction with the local authorities concerned. TII ultimately delivers the national roads programme in line with Project Ireland 2040, the national planning framework and the national development plan.

The Government has earmarked €5.1 billion for capital spending on new national roads projects from 2021 to 2030 as part of the NDP. This funding will enable improved regional accessibility across the country, as well as compact growth, which are key national strategic outcomes. The funding will provide for the development of numerous national road projects, including the completion of projects which are already at construction stage and those close to it, as well as the development of a number of others.

As the greater portion of this funding becomes available in the second half of the decade, this has meant that there is a constraint on the funding available for new projects in 2023 and 2024. However, approximately €491 million of Exchequer capital funds were provided for national roads through TII to local authorities in 2023.

Having regard to the funding constraint outlined above, I understand it was not possible to provide an allocation to all national roads for projects in the NDP for 2023. However, the majority of projects did receive funding, including the N22 Killarney to Farranfore project, which received an allocation of €100,000 in 2023. This project is listed in the current NDP. It would provide bypasses of Farranfore and Killarney and would deliver an improved road between the two towns.

The allocations for 2024, as mentioned by the Deputy, are due to be announced later this week and will provide a full list of projects in Kerry that are receiving allocations. It is not possible to provide an allocation to every project in the NDP for 2024. However, it is important to point out that the N22 Killarney to Farranfore project remains part of the NDP and I can assure the Deputy that sufficient funding is in place to ensure that the route options phase will be concluded in 2024, with a preferred route selected. As with all national roads projects in the NDP, the delivery programme for the N22 Killarney to Farranfore project will be kept under review in future years and considered in terms of the overall funding envelope available to TII.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I thank the Minister of State for the reply. If I understood her right, she said funding would be made available to ensure the route selection. I hope this happens. She mentioned all the other projects and I am sure they are all very worthwhile, but this project has been awaited for almost 25 years, which is a quarter of a century. We have waited long enough and people have lost their lives. The Government is talking about road safety and how it is going to do drastic things to try to curb the number of accidents, many of which are not real or which will have no effect. I am appealing to the Minister of State and my colleagues from Kerry who have a say in the Government's ear and on whom the Government is depending. This is their time. The election will be over by this time next year and there will be a lot of changes. This Government will not be the same the next time out. Who knows who will be here? Deputy Griffin has already said he is not standing the next time. I am appealing to him and the Minister, Deputy Foley, to ensure Kerry gets this funding because it is important to all of Kerry. All of Kerry is adversely affected by the lack of this bypass and we need the funding to progress it.

The Minister of State mentioned that it is up to TII. It is up to that body and I am sure it will perform once the Government gives it the funding. No money, no fun. That is where we are now. So many people have done so much work over a long number of years. The local TII office, formerly the NRA, initiated the project back in 2004 and Kerry County Council's senior management have put, and are putting, a lot of resources and effort into ensuring this worthy project goes ahead. I am appealing to the Minister of State to deliver the message to Government. She is not in the Department of Transport, but I ask her to please bring my message to the Minister, Deputy Ryan.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Deputy for his passionate contribution. I will bring it to the attention of the Minister, Deputy Ryan, and the Deputy's Kerry Oireachtas colleagues, who he mentioned. As I said, there is sufficient funding in place to ensure the route options phase will be concluded in 2024 with a preferred route selected. I note the Deputy's comments around road safety and he makes a valid point. It is important to say that in the period between 2020 and 2023 approximately €118 million in Exchequer capital funding was allocated to the national road network in County Kerry. This has resulted in many improvements to the network, as demonstrated by the Listowel bypass, for example, the construction of which is approaching completion. I have outlined the fact the allocations will be happening later this week and I will certainly bring the Deputy's plea to the attention of the Minister and to TII.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I am sorry, but I just have one query. The Minister of State said the funding is in place. I am advised it is not and €500 million is needed to get the project rolling.

An Cathaoirleach Gníomhach (Deputy Ruairí Ó Murchú)

I thank Deputy Healy-Rae.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The briefing I have, and what I am told by the Minister and indeed the officials in the Department of Transport, is that sufficient funding is in place to ensure the route options phase will be concluded in 2024 with a preferred route selected. As with all national roads projects in the NDP, the delivery programme for the N22 Killarney to Farranfore project will be kept under review in future years and considered in terms of the overall funding envelope available to TI. There are allocations coming out later this week and I hope the project will be successful.

Departmental Regulations

Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan

I thank the Minister of State for taking this Topical Issue. This is an incredibly important issue. It is about HHC and HHC vapes in particular, their prevalence in Ireland, the damage they are causing, the harm they are doing to individuals, especially young people, and the damage they are causing to relationships and particularly families right across Ireland. It is a scourge on our nation and we really need to nip it in the bud.

It is important to outline HHC is a semi-synthetic form of cannabis which is available in these vapes, but there is a big difference between it and cannabis because we know the impacts of cannabis. We know the effects it has on people. Some people describe a relaxed feeling when they have cannabis and that they feel chilled. Some people feel a high. However, we also know there is a psychosis associated with cannabis and a certain percentage of people who take cannabis. That is well-known, well-researched and well-advertised. It is something we know a lot about and therefore people are quite aware of the risks if they go down that route. HHC is like a silent assassin. The impacts it has on people's mental health are not yet widely known. The psychosis element and the connection with psychotic episodes is still not widely known.

I again stress it is young people in particular who are taking these products through vapes, which are widely available, and it is causing havoc. It is perceived as harmless, but though in dosage terms it is maybe half as powerful or whatever as cannabis, because it is in a vape form and people tend to take regular doses over the course of a day, they are getting a bigger load of this HHC and, therefore, it is having a bigger impact. I will give a perfect example of what I mean by that. In a recent Irish study there is pretty concrete evidence of the link between psychotic episodes and taking HHC. In one instance, one of the individuals taking it was a habitual cannabis user and had never had a psychotic episode when taking cannabis. He switched to HHC vapes and after that the psychosis began, the visions began and he began to experience psychotic episodes. The theory behind that is because it was so much more available he was taking it at a much higher dose. This is happening throughout Ireland as people are seeing this as quite a harmless drug, while the impacts are far greater. This stuff creeps up on people and on kids in particular.

These vapes are being sold to kids under 18. They should not be, but it is happening and that is possibly a different issue. Kids are still getting their hands on these because they are widely available in shops and not just vape shops, but shops of all different types. It is causing kids to be withdrawn and to be withdrawn from their families and their friends. They take it because they think they are going to be chilled and it will maybe take the edge off, but it is causing massive problems within their friendship circles and their lives. It is causing anxiety and depression. This is not just being flagged by me but by addiction treatment centres because they are seeing this train coming down the line at speed and we are not ready to deal with it. It is being flagged by CAMHS. It is being flagged by those who are dealing with adolescents and young people with mental health issues. This is coming fast. We need to regulate and bring it under the control of drugs Act. We need to move fast. It has already been flagged as a problem drug by the HSE, but it is too available. We need to stamp it out and ensure it does not do any further damage.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Deputy for his question, which is on a very important issue. I am taking this on behalf of the Minister for Health.

I will open with an explanation of what HHC is and its current legal position. Tetrahydrocannabinol, known as THC, is the principal psychoactive constituent of cannabis. It is a Schedule 1 controlled drug in the Misuse of Drugs Regulations and is subject to the strictest of controls. Hexahydrocannabinol, HHC, is a derivative of tetrahydrocannabinol, but it not a Schedule-controlled drug. It is a naturally-occurring cannabinoid that has rarely been identified as a trace component in cannabis sativa, but can also be produced synthetically by hydrogenation of cannabis extracts. HHC was first identified in Europe in May 2022, which is not that long ago, and was put under intensive monitoring at the end of 2022 by the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction, EMCDDA. It is the first semi-synthetic cannabinoid reported in the EU and has been monitored as a new psychoactive substance by the EU early warning system since October 2022.

Early warning in Ireland is co-ordinated by the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction, EMCDDA, national focal point and the early warning and emerging trends working group chaired by the Department of Health. EWET continues to monitor the emergence and use of this substance in Ireland, which I hope will reassure the Deputy somewhat. HHC has been reported as a drug of concern by the HSE and, as the Deputy mentioned, adolescent service providers. HHC can be contained in vaping products, as he mentioned. There is growing concern about the potential impact of using this substance on young people's mental health, including, as he also mentioned, the possible link with psychosis. Young people report adverse effects such as loss of consciousness after use, and the Deputy mentioned the possible link between that and psychotic episodes.

The HSE will add content about HHC to its website drugs.ie. Evidence as regards harms associated with HHC will be carefully monitored and appropriate responses will be considered. The HSE will continue to liaise with the EMCDDA and the early warning and emerging trends group for further direction on this substance. This is an area currently being monitored by the HSE and the EU drug agency as there is limited information on the health impact of this substance to date.

With regard to synthetic cannabinoids, the HSE has comprehensive harm reduction information about the substances available on its website drugs.ie. The HSE also issued an alert regarding cannabis edibles contaminated with synthetic cannabinoids earlier this year.

Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan

I appreciate the response. The unfortunate thing is that it is almost a carbon copy of responses I have already received from the office of the Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, when I flagged this previously. There are some encouraging elements in the response in that there is clearly an awareness of this substance. There is awareness of the impacts it has on young people and of the psychosis that is linked to it. What I am concerned about, however, is that the same language has been used for the past number of months, in that the issue is being monitored. What I am hearing from parents, however, is that this substance is having an impact on their children now and is changing their children's personality. Vibrant, intelligent, enthusiastic young people are becoming withdrawn, disinterested, depressed and anxious. This is happening now, so we have to go past the monitoring phase. The time now is for action.

More concerningly, as I said in my opening statement, big red flags are being waved by the likes of the child and adolescent mental health services, CAMHS, and drug addiction centres. They are seeing these kids come in in bigger numbers every week.

I do not mean to shoot the messenger. The Minister of State is here reading an answer on behalf of the Minister for Health, and I appreciate that the issue is being monitored, but now is the time for action. This substance needs to be brought under the control of drugs Act. We need to stamp this out. Vapes are a scourge as it is, environmentally and in terms of their accessibility. These are so accessible. They are in every shop and are being sold to kids like sweets. It needs to stop, especially these HHC products, which are clearly causing havoc to kids' mental health. I would love the Minister of State to bring the message back to the Minister that we need to take this more seriously.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Deputy for outlining that. I can see he is concerned about this.

Hexahydrocannabinol is not currently a controlled drug under the Misuse of Drugs Regulations. As the Deputy said, it is being monitored closely at international level by the European Union drugs agency, which I understand is the initial step in placing a substance under drug control measures. It is important to point out that the Criminal Justice (Psychoactive Substances) Act 2010 is an Act to prevent the misuse of dangerous or otherwise harmful psychoactive substances and to provide for offences relating to the sale, importation, exportation or advertisement of those substances. There are protections in place, and anybody who sells a HHC vape, which one would assume is for human consumption, is guilty of an offence under the 2010 Act.

I hear what the Deputy says, however, acknowledging the fact that there is awareness. He just wants to see further progress on this. I would imagine, given that it is being closely monitored, that there will be progression after that. I hear what he says about the drug addiction centres and CAMHS and some of the symptoms or the outcomes that people, particularly young people, have when they inhale this vape, and I will bring his concerns to the attention of the Minister.

Defective Building Materials

Deputy Joe McHugh

I thank the Minister of State for coming here this evening. In 2020, a husband and wife started the process of assessing their house, which they knew at the time had defective blocks. One year later, a young woman - a wife and a mother to three children - sadly passed away. This has been a very difficult and traumatic time for this family, and in the midst of their grieving they still have to contend with a house that is slowly falling down. In the words of the husband, "This is an awful weight hanging over us." This family is being asked to reapply again, to start again the long process of applying to get on the defective blocks scheme, four years later. There has to be flexibility in this scheme which would account for or lend itself to facilitating people in this situation. There is still a disconnect in the understanding of what people are going through. The psychological burden is too heavy for people to endure. The intergenerational trauma is affecting primary students, secondary students and third level students in houses with defective blocks.

When people hear about this scheme, they are quick to make judgment calls: "Sure look at all the money they are getting. Look at their big houses." The reality is that people are caught up in a bureaucratic nightmare and that trying to navigate through this process is nothing short of torture. The issue of defective blocks will not go away and needs to be dealt with. Communication is poor, trust is at an all-time low, and confidence in the process is slowly ebbing away.

Do not get me wrong. Potentially, we could have a good scheme here, but the feedback I am getting is that it is not working at the moment. There are deficiencies and there is an appeals process embedded in the legislation which is not up and running. We have issues with terraced and semi-detached houses. Imagine asking someone in a semi-detached house to knock the house down, with the other house attached to it not being eligible, and move it a couple of inches away from the other house and build what is effectively a detached house in the space of an adjoining house. There is a feeling that there are stalling tactics. There are major issues with people not being able to access credit. There are affordability issues. There are people who face trauma compounded upon trauma.

I ask the Minister of State for her intervention and to make contact with the Minister for housing to ask him to make a personal intervention in the issues I have raised. Furthermore, for the many people who find themselves in very difficult situations, the scheme needs to be addressed. Yes, there will be a review. We do not know when that review will happen or how the scheme will be reviewed, but it has to be done immediately. We have a scheme here that potentially can work but at the moment is not working.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Yes, I will bring this to the attention of the Minister for housing.

I offer my condolences to the family. That is a difficult situation notwithstanding this matter. I note what the Deputy said about the review and that it needs to be done as soon as possible. I will bring those particular comments back to the Minister for housing. I know this mica scheme has been a big issue for the Deputy a very long time and I acknowledge his concerns in that regard.

I am answering this Topical Issue matter on behalf of the Minister, Deputy O'Brien. As the Deputy knows, the Minister commenced the Remediation of Dwellings Damaged by the Use of Defective Concrete Blocks Act 2022 on 22 June 2023, which provides for the enhanced grant scheme, and adopted the related regulations on 29 June 2023.

That Act includes significant improvements to the previous scheme, such as how the previous scheme's 90% maximum grant was increased to a 100% grant for all remediation options 1 to 5, and the maximum grant cap for option 1, that is, demolition and rebuild, was increased to €420,000 from €247,500.

A revised application process was introduced, which now only requires the homeowner to submit an initial building condition assessment at minimal cost, recoupable on entry to the scheme. Alternative accommodation and storage costs are included, subject to a maximum of €20,000. With regard to works carried out under remediation options 2 to 5, a second grant option is available for such a home in the future if blockwork that was not removed as part of the initial remediation work subsequently proves defective in accordance with IS 465.

This Act precludes a change in approved remediation options from 2 to 5 to an option 1, which is full demolition. In such circumstances, the DCB Act obliges a homeowner to submit a new application to the enhanced scheme, which the Deputy mentioned.

I understand that the Minister acknowledges that this may be a matter of concern for homeowners who submitted their original applications some time back and a change in circumstance has now arisen. In order to assist such homeowners in the submission of their revised application, an official from the Department wrote to the chief executive of Donegal County Council on 20 December 2023. In this letter, the Department confirmed the requirement for the certificate of compliance with planning and the additional information, which is required for an application under the enhanced scheme to be considered valid, can be provided at the point when a homeowner submits his or her remedial works plan. The letter also confirmed that applications received from a local authority relating to homeowners in these circumstances will be dealt with expeditiously and without delay by the Housing Agency. I understand that the Minister believes that these two measures, when taken together, will ensure that any additional burden placed on this group of homeowners will be kept to a minimum. The Deputy mentioned how this is a bureaucratic nightmare for people. Obviously, the Government does not want that. This approach will ensure that applications are dealt with as quickly as possible, while adhering to the legislative requirements laid down by the Oireachtas.

Deputy Joe McHugh

I thank the Minister of State for that response. Looking within that script and from listening to the feedback, there seems to be pathway. The issue at the moment, however, is that there is a communication deficit. That is where the difficulty lies. Going back to the original 90:10 scheme, when we all hoped that was going to be the vehicle for helping and assisting people to get out of this situation, communication was an issue then too. Communication is the issue all the time with regard to the difficulties in which people find themselves. This is a humanitarian crisis. There is no other description for it. We are dealing with victims who want their lives to move on.

Having thought about it for a considerable time, I believe this is too big an issue for one Department. Even in my contribution earlier, I was talking about primary and secondary school and the impact on third-level education. There is a role in the Minister of State's own Department and, in fact, the education and training board, ETB, in County Donegal has a submission into the Department of Education regarding assistance, help, support and resources for young people affected by defective blocks in Donegal.

Tonight, in Buncrana, for example, there is a residents meeting about a housing estate that was flooded in 2017. Nine of the houses have defective blocks and they are in a flood plain. The people have come up with a common-sense solution not to reconstruct the houses on this site and to look at relocation. Therefore, the OPW is involved. This is affecting people's health. The Department of Health is involved. I mentioned the Department of Education and OPW. We could go through a litany of other Departments. This complex issue is so wide and varied that I actually believe we need to look at an interdepartmental approach that must be led from the top. I am calling tonight publicly for Cabinet, the Taoiseach's Office and the Taoiseach and Tánaiste to really consider the possibility is setting up a Taoiseach-led interdepartmental group to deal with this issue. As far as I am concerned, since I have been involved in this scheme, there are massive deficits regarding, first, communication and, second, accountability because when things are said, they are not followed through and who is left in the lurch? It is the people who want their lives to move on. They feel they are locked in and fixed in a situation, and that trauma is not getting any lesser. It is an issue that we have. Never mind a legislative obligation, we have a moral obligation to tackle this issue and we still have time to do that.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I thank the Deputy. As I said, I know he is very passionate about this matter and has been for a long time. He acknowledged that there does seem to be a pathway here. I hear his comments around communication, and I will bring that back to the Minister for housing. I will also bring back the Deputy's suggestion around an interdepartmental group.

He mentioned that he wants that review as soon as possible. I understand that this implementation steering group will produce a report on the operation of the enhanced scheme that covers the period July to December 2023, that is, the first six months of that scheme. It should be noted, obviously, that this is not a review of the fundamental terms and conditions of the scheme, but it is a report. That will be submitted for his consideration in the coming weeks to the Minister. I understand he will give it the due care and attention it deserves and note any recommendations of the group. I will certainly bring the Deputy's comments back to the relevant Ministers in this regard.

Cuireadh an Dáil ar athló ar 10.07 p.m. go dtí 9.10 a.m., Dé Céadaoin, an 21 Feabhra 2024.

The Dáil adjourned at 10.07 p.m. until 9.10 a.m. on Wednesday, 21 February 2024.