There is a maximum of one minute for each question.
Ceisteanna ar Pholasaí nó ar Reachtaíocht - Questions on Policy or Legislation
Earlier, I cited the number of 327 children on waiting lists for scoliosis-related surgery. The Taoiseach challenged me on that matter. I wish to put the correct figure on the record of the Dáil, which is, in fact, 333. I had underestimated. This is published data from Children's Health Ireland from 19 February.
The Taoiseach lost no time in summoning the Russian ambassador to Ireland to correctly express outrage at the death of Alexei Navalny and call for an independent investigation into his death. It is lost on no one that the same approach has not been adopted in respect of the Israeli ambassador to Ireland. Israel has broken every rule in the book and breached every law, repeatedly and in plain sight. There are 30,000 dead in Palestine and thousands of children suffering from disease, starving and living under the threat of continued bombardment and death. As of yet, however, the Israeli ambassador has not been summoned to go to Iveagh House. Can I ask why?
I will have to inquire about that. My understanding is that the Israeli ambassador has been summoned to Iveagh House. She certainly met with the Minister and Secretary General in some location about these matters. I will follow up on that.
I will also follow up on the numbers with regard to the waiting list. The numbers I have here are from the Department of Health. I believe them to be correct and Deputy McDonald's to be wrong. That publication might be incorrect or out of date, but we will clarify that.
We have a real problem.
It is shameful.
Drogheda will lose 56% of its tourism hotel beds in March. The nature of the Department of integration's arrangement with the D Hotel must be re-examined. As the Taoiseach knows, the town of Drogheda has a long and proud history of social solidarity and tolerance of pluralism, and that continues. For the vast majority of the people of my town, this was only ever about the loss of key hotel beds. Here is the evidence. On Saturday, the far right organised a protest in my hometown, which 300 people attended. The important point is that 41,000 Droghedians did not. The economic impact of this decision is very real, and evidence shows a loss of at least €5.4 million in revenue locally. There needs to be a mitigation package.
As the Taoiseach knows, I proposed last week that a dual use tourism and international approach should come into play. I want to have the Taoiseach's views on that. We know that Ukrainian families are hosted in hotels side by side with tourists and there are no child protection issues.
I thank the Deputy.
The D Hotel should not be any different. Will the Taoiseach accept and work with me and the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, on the constructive proposal I made for dual use in the D Hotel?
I thank the Deputy.
The Government owes that much to 41,000 Droghedians.
I think Drogheda is a great town. It is a town I have a personal affection for, because when my father came to this country, when he was dragged back to Ireland by his Irish wife, he needed to find a job and found it hard to get one. He found a job in Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital working in the paediatric service there. He always speaks fondly of that town and the people who live there. I know it is a welcoming town to migrants. It is a town that has its troubles, but one which we have put a lot of investment into in recent years for new roads, new housing and major improvements at the hospital and IDA lands purchased to drive job creation. Many good things are happening in Drogheda. Certainly, the situation around criminal activity in gangs has improved considerably as well. I thank the gardaí in Drogheda particularly for their work on that. I understand where the people of Drogheda are coming from in their concerns about this. I pay tribute to the three TDs from Drogheda and the councillors in Drogheda borough for the approach they have taken. They are a credit to their town.
The Minister, Deputy O’Gorman, is meeting representatives from the chamber of commerce and the BID today. He is going to meet councillors tomorrow. If at all possible, we want to want to use a dual use option for the D Hotel. It has been done in my constituency and in Dundalk. It can be done. We think that is the best solution. We are not sure that the operator will fully co-operate, and there may be issues around child protection and so on. I am sure those things can be sorted out, and we want to do so. That would be the best outcome for Drogheda.
I heard about the protest. I understand that during the protest, which was a far-right protest, people from the town were asked to come up and speak and they could not find very many.
Correct.
I think that says a lot.
Last night, the Minister for disability, Deputy O'Gorman, said that Ireland is "falling down in terms of our response to disabled people". For one, Ireland is not falling down. It is the Government. Then, the Minister suggested that a specific referendum on disability rights might be required to prevent this in the future. At this point, I am not sure if the Government is aware of this, but it should not need a referendum to force it to provide rights and services to people with disabilities. It could just do it. Just so we are all clear on this, last night, the Minister conceded that the Government is failing disabled people and suggested it would continue to unless there was a referendum, which it has no plans to hold.
Disability services in this country are a disgrace. They are threadbare and they are ruining people's lives. The Government does not need a referendum to change that.
Thank you, Deputy.
The Government could bring pay parity to children's disability network teams. It could provide adequate personal assistance hours. It could, a decade on from scrapping it, introduce a transport scheme.
Thank you, Deputy, please.
The list goes on. If the Taoiseach has any interest in addressing these shortcomings, he could start by ratifying the optional protocol to the UNCRPD. Will he do that before the family and care referendums?
I fully agree with the Deputy on one point. There is no referendum that will in itself improve services and there is no referendum that is going to build anymore house or anything like that. I totally agree with the Deputy in that regard. It can only ever be a certain part of the picture. We are putting record amounts of resources into disability services. Approximately €2 billion per year goes into disability services. I know there are huge gaps around the country. I meet the same people who are affected and hear the same stories as the Deputy.
Specifically, with regard to the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, that convention was ratified by the previous Government, which I had the honour to lead. It is our intention to ratify the optional protocol on the rights of people with disabilities. I cannot say to the Deputy that it will be done in the next two or three weeks. I wish it had been. Quite frankly, it would have helped. However, I have spoken to the Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, and to the Attorney General about this. I am not satisfied with the reasons being given for it not being done yet, quite frankly. It is my intention and my commitment to do that during the term of office of this Government.
On putting a question to the HSE regarding CAMHS inpatient beds in the State, I received a reply that was slightly alarming. Out of the 72 registered beds in the State, only 51 were operational and, as of October last year, 30 ere occupied. The main reason for this was staff shortages. What has the Government put in place to address these staff shortages that are having a detrimental effect on children's mental health?
I thank the Deputy for raising this important question. He is quite right. Currently, we have 52 beds operational, and 21 beds closed.
The reason they are closed is due to a safe staffing issue. However, what we have been doing is investing more in community teams. We have taken up, where necessary, private capacity, and I am monitoring the waiting list week on week regarding inpatient supports for young people. Whether it is the unit in Merlin Park University Hospital in Galway, Éist Linn in Cork, or Linn Dara in Cherry Orchard Hospital in Dublin, we are keeping a focus on this and the waiting list this week stands at one person waiting for inpatient admittance to a CAMHS unit.
I received a letter last week from a developer in Galway city and I believe it was a copy of a letter he had sent to the Taoiseach regarding An Bord Pleanála. He submitted an application for planning under the strategic housing development forum back in August 2022. The inspector prepared his report on the application, submitted it to the board in January 2023, and here we are in February 2024 and the board has still not made a decision. This is a development of 170 houses and the developer wants to know if An Bord Pleanála will make a decision on it one way or the other. He is not asking us to influence the board. The more appalling thing is that there are 21,500 houses stuck in that logjam in An Bord Pleanála at the moment. I know we have given increased resources to An Bord Pleanála but it is not enough. It needs more and it needs it now if we are to try to get through what is stuck in this system as quickly as possible.
I thank the Deputy. There are delays in An Bord Pleanála at the moment and that is particularly the case with SHDs. Some of that is linked to a court case, the outcome of which the board needed to know before it could decide on these applications. I met with the new chairperson of An Bord Pleanála about this and with the Minister. The board is getting the additional resources and staff it needs but it will take a bit of time to get through the backlog. Having met with An Bord Pleanála, I am now confident the backlog is now already coming down and will be resolved.
We have a route option selection process going on for the new N24. I am talking specifically about the Cahir to Waterford stretch, or Cahir to Carrick-on-Suir in our case in Tipperary. Clonmel has a bypass for 20-odd years and it is like a car park morning and evening. It is proposed now to use that same bypass to link up with the new road. This is totally impractical. Clonmel town needs an outer ring road to take the traffic out of the town. It beggars belief that after all the planning, designing, land sterilisation and the planning permission being held up, we are back now looking at using the Clonmel bypass. They cannot widen it because there is nothing to widen. I am talking about from the Cahir Road roundabout to Moangarriff Road roundabout on the southern side and they need a proper outer relief road to relieve that bypass that is already chock-a-block with workers going to work, with housing, schools and everything. It is a car park from 7 until 10 in the morning and then the same in the evening. It is busy all the time as well. We need that rethought and we need to go back to the drawing board. They had sterilised the land for this road but now they are decided they are not doing it.
I am very familiar with the town of Clonmel as the Deputy knows. I am not familiar with the particular roads project so I will have to ask the Minister, Deputy Ryan, to come back to him directly on that. We have an issue around the country which we have to have a think about. There are a whole load of towns that have a bypass that are now seeking a bypass of the bypass. We have to ask ourselves if we are getting it wrong in terms of road planning that the bypass was not the right one in the first place or whether there is too much car-based development and the bypass of the bypass in time will need another bypass, which is not good planning.
I raise the issue of the West Bank. While the eyes of the world are understandably focused on Gaza, the horror that is anticipated there and, indeed, the apparent green light the Americans have given through the use of their veto, people are not looking at the West Bank and there has been a huge increase in the number of attacks on Palestinians and their properties there. Is there a role for the Irish representative office there in recording and documenting this? Is there an increased role for the EU office and would the Taoiseach propose to increase support for either to record what is happening in the West Bank so that it can be tackled and dealt with in tandem, of course, with the focus he has brought to Gaza? I support him in what he is doing with the Spanish Premier with regard to the trade association.
I thank the Deputy. We can certainly give that consideration. I would have to talk to the Tánaiste about it as it is, ultimately, his budget to manage rather than mine. However, we have increased funding for UNRWA, of which the Deputy will be aware. That was an important signal. Other countries suspended their funding. We said we were going to increase it. It is alleged that some UNRWA staff were involved in the terrorist attacks, but that should be proven. It has not been proven yet, despite what the Israeli authorities claim, and we have increased funding for the ICC to help it collect evidence on the ground. Therefore, we are certainly happy to give that consideration but I will have to speak to the Tánaiste about it.
The Taoiseach will be aware that, because of ash dieback, a significant number of ash trees have to be felled this year in the interest of public safety. Due to the significant number of trees to be felled, there is a backlog and farmers are finding it more difficult to access contractors to do this by 1 March in the hedge-cutting season. Is any consideration being given to extending the hedge-cutting season, even by a number of weeks, to facilitate farmers in carrying out this much-needed work? As we know, many of these trees are on the side of the road, and from a public health and safety perspective, it is important the Government would consider giving flexibility to farmers to carry out this work.
I absolutely appreciate the concerns of landowners but road safety is one of the issues that is not covered under the Wildlife Act. Therefore the cutting of trees that are causing, or have the potential to cause, a road safety hazard can still be carried out but there are no plans to extend out the hedge-cutting season.
More than 100,000 people have found refuge in our country in recent years from war, famine and so on. Very important decisions have been made. However, the people of Drogheda are extremely angry or concerned at the fact they are losing their only remaining functioning hotel. They are more than willing to play their part but this is not acceptable. They are losing a resource that is essential. Will the Taoiseach meet with public representatives, businesses and leaders in the community to find a solution to this? The policy is wrong. It is seen as arrogant and uncaring right now. I know the intention of the Minister is to do what is best, but this is the wrong way to deal with the problem. It is giving a voice to those who are extremists in our community and we need an urgent, immediate and effective resolution of the problem.
My office is trying to set up those meetings as we speak based on our conversation last Thursday or Friday. I put on record that Drogheda is a town that welcomes migrants and has done from all parts of the world for all sorts of different reasons. I understand the concern that taking out such a large hotel will have a major negative impact on a town, a town that has come on so much in recent years. The solution on which the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, is working is a dual use option where some of the hotel will provide accommodation for people seeking protection but the rest of the hotel can still be open to tourists and visitors and still operate function rooms and so on. It is done elsewhere, including in my own constituency. I hope we can make that the solution and then perhaps provide some additional finance for community facilities in the town. We can get there but we will need the co-operation of the operator and to sort out any issues that might arise around safety and child protection.
Are audits currently being undertaken in communities where decisions have been taken to place refugees? As far as I can see, none are being carried out. In my own constituency of Wicklow, there are more than 100 Ukrainians now in the small rural village of Carnew, which has a part-time GP service, and it currently takes two to three weeks for people to get an appointment. The local secondary school is at capacity. They are relying on Portakabins which are stacked high and pupils are crammed in. There are similar issues in Tinahely and in Baltinglass where there are sizeable numbers of Ukrainians located, and now we hear the IPAS is looking at a premises in Dunlavin - another rural area - to house 32 people. This is an area with similar challenges in respect of school places and GPs. This is rural west Wicklow where public transport is non-existent. Is the Government being led by speculators who are making millions from this process or is there an actual plan that looks at services-----
Thank you, Deputy.
-----and amenities in areas before a decision is taken and addresses any deficit. Otherwise, the Government is failing-----
Time is up, Deputy, please.
-----communities and indeed refugees.
There is only one thing by which we are being led and that is the reality around the world and the realities on the ground. More people are on the move now than at any time since the Second World War. Millions of people have left Ukraine and people are leaving Africa and the Middle East for lots of different reasons such as poverty, conflict and war. Approximately 1.5 million or 2 million people entered the European Union irregularly last year.
It is not a surprise that 1% or 2% of them might come to Ireland.
I am proud that we have welcomed 100,000 Ukrainians to Ireland. I do not think we will regret that in ten or 20 years time. I think it reflects very well on our society. Approximately 80,000 Ukrainians are still here. I appreciate that when the population increases, it puts pressure on services. What we have tried to do around healthcare is provide a visiting GP service so that it does not put additional pressure on existing practices. We have provided additional resources to schools as well. Where we can, we have put in transport. I totally appreciate that in some places, that still has not been done or is still in process.
I raise again the disappearance in July 2020 in Portugal of my constituent and family friend, Jean Tighe. Jean's family has sought every possible assistance daily to locate their beloved daughter and sibling. I have made numerous representations to the Departments of Foreign Affairs and Justice to stress the absolute necessity of ensuring proper and adequate searches are undertaken to locate Jean. It took an inordinate and totally unacceptable time for the Portuguese police authorities to put Jean's name on the missing persons database. It was clear from early on that modern investigative and search tools were not used in the search. I have called repeatedly for an investigation into Jean's disappearance that is absolutely comprehensive and thorough. I was extremely disappointed and indeed furious to learn that the Portuguese authorities have been awaiting responses from An Garda Síochána and the Department of Justice for some time. The least our authorities can do is to act with urgency. We have a young woman who is missing and a very distraught family, friends and community. This State, by its actions, must show that it cares.
I am familiar with the case of Jean Tighe. I really feel for the family concerned. I know that the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs is aware of this case and has taken action on it. I know our embassy and our staff on the ground in Lisbon are doing all they can. If it is of any use, I will meet the Prime Minister of Portugal in a few weeks' time, around middle or late March. I am not sure whether it will be the new prime minister or the existing one. If the Deputy wants to give me a short letter or something like that, I will take the opportunity to pass it on to him then.
It has been four months almost to the day since Storm Babet devastated my part of the country. The Taoiseach and Ministers visited and offered huge support, which was very welcome. What we did not see at the time was the devastation caused to roads. There was approximately €60 million worth of damage. I am told that the Department of Transport can only give €13 million at the moment. Some roads are almost impassable. Will the Taoiseach work with his Cabinet colleagues to increase the amount of money from the Exchequer to the county council so that these roads can be brought back into use?
I am happy to work on that. The general principle which was applied in other places, including County Donegal, was that once the Department had assessed the damage and the work that would need to be done, a special allocation would be made that was over and above the regular roads grant. What the Deputy is saying to me is that an allocation has been made but it is not enough. If the Deputy and I have the opportunity this Wednesday evening or the next one, we will attempt a pincer movement on the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, and see what we can do to get that additional special allocation. It is not just money from the Department of Transport; it is a special allocation and it falls into a different category.
I raise the issue of the problems caused by the Government's policy of privatising immigration and impact it has on communities, services and people seeking international protection. Not once were public representatives, the TDs, in Drogheda contacted in advance of that contract being signed to ask for our opinions or how it would impact our town. It was only after the contract was signed that we were contacted. The Taoiseach said over the weekend that a partial reversal of that decision was being examined, namely the dual-use option. However, the Minister had told us the day before that this was not possible and that the contract had been signed. We are now 16 days out from the change. The Taoiseach has said he is examining the issue now. Will he tell us what progress was made? When will we know? The Taoiseach has acknowledged that the dual-use option was used in three other areas, so why was it not used as part of the negotiations for the D Hotel in Drogheda? Why was nothing done until the contract was signed? When will we know if the dual-use option - the Minister said that it was impossible to change and could not be changed - can be changed by the Taoiseach?
I thank the Deputy, the time is up.
I presume he is not just stringing people in Drogheda along.
I thank the Deputy. The dual-use option can be done because it was done in Blanchardstown and in Dundalk. I know it can be done. It will require a change to the contract. That is the truth of it but I think it can be done and it would be the best outcome all round. Perhaps that is what should have been done in the first place. I acknowledge that, but we are where we are now. We are working on that solution.
Bus Éireann has the contract for delivering the school bus transport system, which takes all of our national and secondary school children to schools. It is a fact that there is a scarcity of school bus drivers. However, drivers of 70 years of age are no longer considered by Bus Éireann. It will not allow them to drive buses. Of course the safety of children is of paramount importance. There is discrimination against men and women when they become 70 years of age. They can drive lorries and buses all over the country. It is ironic that they can drive the same children to a football match, a picnic or whatever after school.
Your time is up, Deputy.
They can drive in a private capacity. I will say one thing: it could be a condition that they would be medically assessed by doctors appointed by Bus Éireann.
I thank the Deputy. I have been trying to get to the bottom of this for more than a year now. I have not received a straight answer or an adequate explanation. It would appear to be a Bus Éireann or CIÉ rule rather than a Government rule because we allow people to drive lorries into their 70s. People can be Members of this House into their 70s or 80s. It is not about age; it is about someone's physical or mental capacity. I agree that a workable solution might be an annual check of some sort, as the Deputy mentioned. I think it may be a Bus Éireann rule that is tied in some ways to industrial relations agreements, pensions and so on. I am trying to get to the bottom of it.
On page 55 of the programme for Government, there is a commitment to introduce a social housing passport to allow households to move from one local authority housing list to another. This provision has been in every single programme for Government for the past 15 years, but there does not seem to be any movement on it. Bizarrely, there does not seem to be any objection to it on the Government's side. Maybe the reason it is not happening is inertia or a complete lack of interest.
I will explain the impact this has by way of illustration from one of my constituents. She was in Dublin city and was on the DCC list. She could not find anywhere to live so she moved to Balbriggan. She has now been in Balbriggan for 12 years, having spent 14 years on the DCC list. She nominated Balbriggan as one of her areas. Now she is imminently close to being housed in Dublin city, but she cannot be expected to have put her whole life on hold in the intervening time. She has had kids, she has worked in Balbriggan and her partner works in Balbriggan. She now has to choose between moving back into Dublin city, or losing those years and going onto the Fingal list, where she will stay for approximately 13 years. When will we get the social housing passport?
I thank the Deputy. We are working on the social housing passport and we want to do it. To an extent, it exists already in Dublin. A person can be on more than one list in Dublin but I appreciate that may not be the case-----
They cannot transfer their time.
-----in this case. It makes sense to me that if people move county, or move back to their home county they are originally from, they should be able to carry the years they waited with them. However, there are safeguards we want to put in place. The Deputy will appreciate that people who have been on the housing list for a very long time - five, six, seven, eight or ten years - in Swords or Blanchardstown might not respond so well to people coming from other parts of the country and pushing them down the list. I am sure there is a way to sort it out.
You could just build houses, I suppose.
It appears that the enthusiasm the Taoiseach recently expressed to me in this House about investing in Waterford Airport is not supported by his two Government partners. The Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, received the airport's business case on 13 December and signed a parliamentary question response to me on 11 January stating that. Despite his amnesia around that matter, he has let it be known that he has zero appetite for this project. The Government has invested heavily in all other regional airports, with the Tánaiste prominent in his support for Cork Airport. Unfortunately, he loses all interest in capital spending once it heads east of the Dunkettle interchange. The Taoiseach's recently stated support for the project needs to be made real. This means committing his power and influence to ensure the business case is properly considered. Without a Government response soon, the project procurement timelines will torpedo any hope of a 2024 build commencement. This week, the Government announced €1.5 billion of additional capital expenditure. None of it was in the south east, by the way.
Does the Taoiseach support the political resistance, dressed up as bureaucratic bungling, that is jeopardising the delivery of this project in the south east? Will he commit that a decision on the project will be agreed in time to meet the 2024 build schedule?
I do not honestly believe there is "political resistance" to this, certainly not from the Tánaiste. The Minister of State, Deputy Butler, Deputy Ó Cathasaigh and Senator Cummins have all been on to me about this important matter. The business case has been received and it is being examined. I believe Department officials may have met with the airport last week because they had some further questions about it. The commitment made by the previous Government, of which I was the leader, was that we would match the investment 50:50. It is certainly my personal intention and desire that this commitment should be honoured.
It is stated in media reports this morning that almost 1,000 asylum seekers are living in tents on our streets. This is at a time when the Department that is supposed to be looking after asylum seekers is rejecting properties around the country that have gone through the five stages to qualify. Alongside that, you have the 13,000 homeless. Is it not that time that the Taoiseach would look at these figures and use the properties that have been rejected, thereby allowing those who have invested in those properties to receive some of the supports that they expected in the beginning from the State? It appears to me that there is no joined-up thinking here, that the policy on asylum seekers is really a shambles, and that properties remain refurbished but vacant.
It is the case that there are almost 1,000 asylum seekers who have sought accommodation by the State and have not received it. We are just no longer in a position to provide State accommodation to every asylum seeker that comes into the country. We need to make sure people know that. If they are leaving another safe country where they have accommodation, they should know that it is inadvisable to come to Ireland, at least until we are in a much better space around accommodation. It is not the case that they are all in tents or on the streets. Many have found accommodation, often with people they know from back home or through the various networks that people have.
With regard to those properties, I am not familiar with them. There may be a good reason; there might not be. If there are two or three the Deputy is particularly aware of, he might give the information and some details on them and I will get my people to follow it up to see if there is a good reason. Sometimes there is a good reason that the owner might not tell you but that might not be the case, so let us look into it.
There are three remaining Deputies, and we are out of time. We will take 30-second questions from each of the three. Deputy Alan Dillon is first.
The details of RTÉ's exit packages to its senior executives and managers, including their negotiation and approval process, remain undisclosed. Despite the promises of transparency and reform, what we have heard from RTÉ since last summer suggests that a tendency to hide, evade and obscure the truth is deeply ingrained in its culture. As RTÉ evolves into a leaner organisation in the future, voluntary exit schemes and packages are likely to be offered to future executives. Does the Taoiseach feel that our national broadcaster should continue to use confidentiality and non-disclosure agreements for these exit packages? Should there be a cap on severance packages for senior executives and managers?
We have almost 9,000 apprentices waiting for off-the-job training who want to build the homes that we so desperately need. This is a real-life impact. I received a message from one such apprentice and he said:
Hi, I am an apprentice. I have been working for below-minimum wage as a plumber for the last 17 months. I am still waiting to go to phase 2 for over a year. I feel exploited since I have not been to college. I have been worked to my limits on a wage of €7.52 an hour. I have given all to my craft and I have had nothing but hardship given back but I continue to work hard every day.
What is the Taoiseach going to do about it?
Rarely have I heard so many breast cancer survivors and their families express such a level of outrage and anger as I have heard with regard to the HSE's 50% cut to the provision of mastectomy bras, mastectomy prostheses and post-mastectomy swimwear. These medical devices are essential to help to prevent lymphedema, and to give women just a little confidence to face the world. The HSE is now saying to women that it will provide one mastectomy bra per year instead of the current two. How is this possible? Who has decided on this mean-spirited and unacceptable policy? Will the Taoiseach personally intervene to change it?
I thank the Deputies for their questions.
In response to Deputy Dillon's question on RTÉ, I acknowledge his work and that of Deputy Griffin on the committee. It is fair to say that Deputy Dillon is as clinical in the committee room as he was on the pitch. Yes, I believe there should be a cap. There usually is in these schemes. It is usually a maximum of one year's salary, two years' salary or something like that. I absolutely agree that confidentiality clauses should be avoided by public bodies. There might be cases where there is a good reason for them but it seems they were the norm rather than the exception in RTÉ, and that is not right.
Deputy Farrell raised the issue of apprenticeship rates. That is something that is currently under examination-----
It was about the waiting list.
For?
There are 9,000 apprentices waiting for off-the-job training.
Okay. I am sorry, I thought the Deputy had raised something else. It is not the amount they are paid but the numbers waiting for their training. I will follow that up with the Minister, Deputy Harris. Obviously, we are keen to get as many apprentices through as possible because they are pretty desperately needed, particularly in construction.
With regard to Deputy Harkin's question, that was not a Government decision. I only became aware of it, I think, yesterday, so I have asked my staff to look into it. Maybe there is a good reason but I would love to know what it is, quite frankly. I do not support that kind of penny-pinching, particularly when it involves people who are recovering from cancer.