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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 15 May 2024

Vol. 1054 No. 2

Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

I welcome the Minister, Deputy Humphreys, and to what looks like being a local affair, we welcome Deputy Carthy, who will ask the first question.

I welcome the Palestine women's national soccer team to Ireland and commend Bohemian Football Club on hosting the squad for their match this evening.

What does it say about the Minister's party's record that after 13 years in government, families are forced to go onto the media to beg for the services to which their children with disabilities are legally entitled. Recently, another desperate mother had to go public to report that her little boy will miss out on starting school later this year because he has not received his assessment of need. The HSE has confirmed that almost 10,000 children await an assessment of need the Government is obliged to provide within three months. All over the State, there are little boys and girls who need help and services. Their parents know this, their childcare providers or teachers know this and very often, their young siblings know this but they cannot access the help or services they need. Many cannot access appropriate school places or special protection supports without an assessment. They cannot get access to services with or without an assessment because of intolerable waiting lists. Can the Minister imagine the frustration, pain and anger of a mother or father who knows their child's life could improve drastically if only he or she could get access to an occupational therapist, to speech and language therapy or to a place in the right class in the right school but who finds the Government's failures are preventing the child from getting a fair chance of accessing those things?

An assessment of need identifies whether a person has a disability, any health or educational needs that arise from that disability, as well as what services are required to meet those needs. The Government has a legal obligation to provide an assessment of need under the Disability Act but true to Fine Gael form, the Government has been trying to shortcut the assessment process and this was called out by the High Court. The Government is now overseeing record waiting lists for assessments and 8,000 of the children have been waiting for more than three months. Some parents have gone to the expense of getting assessments carried out privately but the HSE will not accept them, while of course many families do not have the wherewithal to even consider that option. For those who do receive an assessment of need, very often they find their battle has just begun. Waiting lists for OTs, for speech and language therapy and other services are disgracefully long. Many find that the special education requirements of their child cannot be met because the Government continues to play catch-up rather than plan for the educational needs of children it knows are coming into the system.

The problem is, of course, worse in our native County Monaghan, which is just one of only two counties that do not have a special school despite the need being identified many years ago. What does the Minister say to the mother today who is looking at her little boy who does not have a school place next September? What does she say to those parents who are wondering when their child will receive the diagnosis they need for educational and health supports? What does the Minister say to those whose children have been assessed, who know what their child's needs are but who are being told those needs will not be met? After 13 years in government, what assurance will the Minister give to those families who will have to fight the Government every single day of their child's life just to get the services that will allow their children to have the start that every parent would want for their son or daughter?

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. I know it is one on which both he and I are committed to seeing progress. In representing our constituents, we all have had the experience of meeting parents who have been waiting for too long for the assessment of their children's needs - both of us have done that - and unfortunately, then for the therapies they also need.

We must do all we can to relieve the pressure on these families and on front-line staff. The Deputy will be aware that the Taoiseach has established a new Cabinet committee on children, education and disability, which includes all responsible Ministers and Departments. This committee has already met a number of times and the issue of disability has been front and centre. At the most recent meeting, there was a focus on the waiting list for assessment of need and on how we can increase the use of the private sector to deliver results for families who are waiting for long periods. Private assessments are already taking place with €16.5 million already set aside for the HSE to procure diagnostic ASD assessments through the private sector and we are examining what more we can do.

That work is very much being led by the Taoiseach, who is working extremely closely with the Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, and the Minister, Deputy Donnelly. The Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, visited our own constituency. She came up to Monaghan and she met the people at first hand. She spoke to them and there is no better person to advocate and work extremely hard for the rights of people with special needs and with disabilities. I am pleased to say today that the Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, together with the Taoiseach and the Minister, Deputy Donnelly, is spearheading a new long waiting list initiative. That will be announced very shortly and will be underpinned by both investment and importantly, a real sense of urgency to address this issue.

The Deputy also mentioned children with special educational needs. For them to receive a high-quality education is also a priority for this Government. More than a quarter of the entire education budget is dedicated to special education and the Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, who sits at the Cabinet table, takes responsibility for this portfolio. In that capacity she is determined to be a voice for special education and inclusion at the highest level of government. The new Cabinet committee on children, education and disability includes all responsible Ministers and Departments and I know the Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, is reviewing the need for special schools across the country and that is something she is working on together with the Minister, Deputy Foley.

I absolutely acknowledge, as does the Deputy, the need for a new special needs school in County Monaghan. We have a fine upgraded facility in Cootehill, County Cavan, namely, the Holy Family School. It recently received a multimillion euro investment and is state-of-the art but unfortunately there is a waiting list there and there are more and more children who require this service. This Government is committed to providing the services we need to make sure our children get priority.

All of that would count for something if this problem had just emerged in the past number of weeks or months.

This problem has been getting steadily worse under this Government. For all of the task forces and all of the reviews proposed by the Minister, there are immediate solutions that need to be implemented. Deputies Cullinane and Tully and other members of the Opposition have told the Government what they are. Most importantly, the families of the children involved and the professionals directly involved in providing these services have told the Government what the solutions are.

The Government needs to end the recruitment embargo on HSE primary care services. The Government needs to fully resource and staff children's disability teams. The Government needs to end the disparity between HSE and section 39 disability service providers. The Government needs to plan special education places. We do not need a review. We do not need an assessment to tell us that counties Monaghan and Leitrim, the two counties without special schools, need them. We need the plan in place to deliver them as a matter of urgency and we need to implement the comprehensive workforce plan to sustainably staff the health services and end the excruciating waiting lists.

I asked the Minister what she would say to those families today who are in dire circumstances because their children are being denied the services they need right now. They deserve an answer to those very important questions.

I know the parent the Deputy is talking about. I have spoke to that lady as well. I know the difficulty she faces and that she has tried approximately four different schools and is having difficulties. I know that and we are doing all we can to support her. We need to explore greater use of the private sector when it comes to the assessment of need. We also need to grow the teams within the HSE which are providing much-needed therapies and increase training places within our third-level sector so that we improve services, increase capacity and reduce waiting lists.

In this regard, the progressing disability services roadmap for 2023 to 2026 was launched last October. It focuses on the ongoing development of children's disability network teams and services to meet current and growing demand.

We are investing greatly in CDNTs, with funding equating to almost 800 whole-time equivalent posts, including approximately 175 therapy assistant posts, approved in this year's budget. There was no embargo on recruiting people who could carry out assessments of need for children. There was a derogation on that in terms of staffing. All the resources we could find and put into that have been put into that. There has been a lot done in that area. I agree that we have to do more.

Today, on Nakba day, we stand in solidarity with the people of Gaza and Palestine. Amid the horror of Netanyahu's genocidal siege on Gaza, the compassionate response of people here in Ireland has been notable. They have stood up for human rights, humanitarianism and international law. In recent weeks, we have seen this in the incredible activism of students in Trinity College Dublin and across other campuses. We have seen it this week in the generosity of spirit shown by Bohemian Football Club, the women's football team, supporters and others towards the Palestinian women's football team who are here. I saw it last week during a visit to Ratoath, in County Meath, when seven-year-old Minnie McDermott gave me a hand written letter she asked me to pass on to the Taoiseach, asking him to take stronger action to ban trade with Israel. She was distressed, as many children across Ireland are, to know about the boys and girls her age in Gaza being killed, living under siege and facing famine.

Across the island, communities are showing solidarity with the beleaguered people of Gaza. This is what makes the continuation of Irish trade with companies in the occupied territories all the more perverse. There have been positive moves from the Government, and I appreciate, as we all do, the movement of the Government towards recognition of the Palestinian state. That is very welcome. We have been proud of Ireland's steadfast support for an immediate ceasefire to bring an end to the horrendous killing in Gaza and the return of all hostages. Yet, those actions are undermined as long as Ireland remains financially embedded in Israel's economy.

While trade ties remain with Israel, we are indirectly funding all that we find so abhorrent, such as the incursion into Rafah, the destruction of aid at the border and the killing of children, medics and aid workers by the Israeli Defence Forces. There have been brutal scenes this week alone. In 2023, Ireland imported €3.6 billion worth of Israeli goods. In the first two months of this year alone, €608 million worth of Israeli goods came into the State and Ireland remains a top ten importer of goods from Israel. These statistics must appal all of those who are calling for action and taking steps in their lives to stand against war.

While we continue to wait for the delayed review of the EU-Israel association agreement at EU level, we need action now from the Government. We must urgently see passage of the Control of Economic Activity (Occupied Territories) Bill put forward by Senator Frances Black. The repeated dismissal by Government of Opposition proposals to sanction Israel are frustrating. We hear that the Government cannot legislate to bring about trade bans but the treaties governing EU trade make it clear that exceptions can be made where bilateral trade is contrary to public policy or public morals. As our Labour Party colleague, Niamh Hourigan put it, famine hovers over the people of Gaza as a horrific spectre but companies continue to export at leisure. Does the Minister agree that now is the time to pass the Control of Economic Activity (Occupied Territories) Bill and introduce meaningful trade sanctions on Israel?

I thank the Deputy for raising this. The Tánaiste confirmed this morning that Ireland will recognise the state of Palestine by the end of this month. We are calling urgently for an immediate and sustainable humanitarian ceasefire, the unconditional release of all hostages and full, safe and unhindered humanitarian access. The protection of civilians must be paramount. It is an obligation under international humanitarian law. Accountability for civilian deaths is essential. Ireland calls for de-escalation by all actors in the region. Regional de-escalation and the protection of civilians and aid workers must remain the priority. We need an immediate and durable ceasefire now, and sustained and unhindered humanitarian access to the civilian population is essential. All hostages must be released.

Ireland is not financially embedded. There was a small investment by the Ireland Strategic Investment Fund, ISIF, which has been divested. In terms of the Control of Economic Activity (Occupied Territories) Bill, the position of the Government is that the Bill would not be compatible with EU law and would, therefore, not be implementable. This is the clear legal advice on this matter. The Government will not, therefore, take it forward. Ireland's opposition to illegal Israeli settlements is unambiguous and is grounded in international law. To adopt a unilateral approach that runs contrary to legal advice would undermine Ireland's stance on this issue and our broader advocacy and compliance with international law.

We have worked very hard with the relevant authorities in Gaza to facilitate the exit of Irish citizens and immediate dependants who have expressed a wish to leave. The Department has been able to assist more than 100 Irish citizens and dependents to leave. This is a very difficult situation and what we see on our televisions is heart-wrenching stuff. We have been very clear in calling for a humanitarian ceasefire. Like Deputies Carty and Bacik, I commend Bohemian Football Club on entertaining and bringing over the Palestinian women's team. I wish them well. I thank them for that. It is the right thing to do.

We all acknowledge and warmly welcome the actions of Bohemian Football Club and its hospitality to the Palestinian team. I have welcomed the moves towards Palestinian statehood, the comments of the Tánaiste today and the support for a ceasefire. We need more meaningful steps to be taken on trade. The Minister said the Government's opposition to the Control of Economic Activity (Occupied Territories) Bill is based on legal advice, presumably from the Attorney General. When was that advice given? Why has it not changed since the war began and we have seen an escalation? This week alone, we have seen further escalation that has led US Government policy to change.

Article 24 of the EU regulation on imports from non-member states allows for bans on the import of goods on the grounds of public morality and public policy or the protection of health and human life. The same exception applies under Article 36 of the treaty on the functioning of the European Union regarding goods in circulation within the EU. I cannot see how a ban on the importation of goods does not fall under these grounds.

Will the Minister ask the Attorney General to update the advice in light of the continuing escalation of genocidal actions, killings, besiegement, looming famine and the looming ground engagement of Rafah that we are all fearful will escalate matters to an even more unthinkable degree of horror for the people of Gaza? Why can we not see updated advice from the Attorney General that takes these matters into account in considering the approach of the Government to the Bill?

I condemn the incursions into Rafah. These people have nowhere to go. I know all of us in the House condemn it. It is wrong that people are left in that awful situation. I have been very clear on the issue of the Control of Economic Activity (Occupied Territories) Bill. It is something we have taken legal advice on. Ireland's opposition to the illegal Israeli settlements is unambiguous and grounded in an international law, as I said. The Deputy has asked whether we will look at the Bill again. These things are always kept under review, but I cannot see that the advice is going to change. Nevertheless, I take on board what she has said.

The US Government's policy-----

I also wish to raise with the Minister the issue of special needs. Raising a child with special needs is challenging and rewarding. It is demanding, yet fulfilling. For parents, it becomes a labour of love in almost every sense. They want what is best for their son or daughter. They want their child to have the best possible start in life.

They plan for the years ahead when their child may no longer have their care and support. They aim to set the best foundation to support their child throughout his or her life.

I attended an action for autism rally in Tipperary earlier this month. This event was organised by two mothers who have reached the limit of their endurance. They and most of those who joined them have battled for years for services for children. Seeing parents of children with special needs marching through the streets to fight for their children's needs is heartbreaking. They have come to believe, with good reason, that seeking what their children urgently need through the established channels is a fruitless exercise. Today I received a letter signed by all of the teachers in Scoil Chormaic in Cashel. It sets out a catalogue of neglect. The school community there is suffering because of a lack of resources and services. For as long as most Members in this House can remember, there have been calls to regulate, reform and resource all areas of the special needs sector. There have been some improvements, which are acknowledged and appreciated, but the reality is that they merely touch the edges of an issue that is impacting the most vulnerable members of our society.

The demands of parents for their special children are no more than any child in the country deserves. They are pleading for timely assessments for their children. This is the first hurdle on their journey for their child and is what will guide future decisions but the reality is that this is the hardest hurdle to cross. The most recent figures available show that there are almost 7,000 children across the country waiting for such assessments. The outcome is crucial as it will establish if they need disability, health or educational support and will determine the road ahead. While they wait to be called for these assessments, the lives of the family and, most especially, the child are left in limbo.

Their next hurdle is finding a suitable place in the education system and proper SNA support. This can be soul-destroying for parents who face many closed doors before they, hopefully, find one that will open to them. All the while, the lives of these children are on hold. It is a sad reflection on the Government and all of us here, as Members of this House, that as a country and as human beings we are continuing to let these children and their families down. This is both a legacy and current issue that should unite this Dáil in meaningful action. The Minister referred to the Taoiseach taking initiatives. Could she please update the House on the progress that has been made on those initiatives and when we can expect to see results?

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue, which I know is one about which he feels very strongly. He has advocated for Scoil Chormaic in Cashel previously. As I said earlier, we all have the experience, in representing our constituents, of meeting parents who are waiting too long for an assessment of their children's needs and for the therapies they need. We have to do all we can to relieve the pressure. The Taoiseach has established a new Cabinet committee on children, education and disability, which includes the responsible Ministers and Departments. The committee has met on a number of occasions and the issue of disability has been front and centre. At the most recent meeting, there was a focus on the waiting list for assessments of need and how we can increase the use of the private sector to deliver results for families waiting long periods. Private assessments are already taking place and €16.5 million has been set aside for the HSE to procure diagnostic ASD assessments through the private sector. This work is being led by the Taoiseach, working closely with the Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Rabbitte and the Minister for Health, Deputy Donnelly. The Minister of State works day and night to do more to support families and she does hold her officials to account. I can assure the Deputy of that because I have seen it first-hand.

Special educational needs is an issue to which the Minister of State at the Department of Education, Deputy Naughton, who sits at the Cabinet table, is totally committed, along with the Minister for Education, Deputy Foley. They are committed to providing more spaces for children with special needs. Seven special schools and two thirds of all special classes were established by this Government. We will open more special schools this year and capacity in special schools around the country will also be increased, as has happened in recent years. A significant number of new special classes, numbering approximately 400, have been sanctioned for September. Of those, arrangements have been finalised for approximately 300, with the remainder being identified in the coming weeks. That is not to say, as this work continues, that we do not have huge sympathy for families looking to secure a special education place. I am aware of that and know how difficult it is for families. Sometimes special education places in mainstream schools do not meet the needs of the child involved and he or she may need to go to a special school. We are committed to improving those services. Again, I thank the Deputy for raising this matter.

During the Covid pandemic, the health service came together and we used the private sector to very good effect. In this case, the big problem is with the assessments. We do not have enough child psychologists in the public sector. They are in the private sector and we should make a once-off effort to get them to combine and do whatever is necessary to reduce the backlog. There are young children waiting for two or three years for an assessment, which is simply unjust and unfair. It needs to be dealt with forthwith.

There are 100 special schools across Ireland. The reality is that number is failing to meet demand. Similarly, many special needs classes in national schools are also struggling to cater for those who need a place. In terms of providing appropriate education, the special school and special needs classrooms model has proven to be successful. Special needs children get lost in mainstream schools. There is neither the time or the opportunity to nurture their abilities. There is a need for increased access to specialised services offered through special needs education. That is what parents are demanding, what they know is required, and what their children need and deserve.

In 2021, we did clear the list. There is a framework in place now and there is €16.5 million available to procure the services for special needs assessments in the private sector. The Deputy is absolutely right that we need to clear the list and we will do so. The necessary funding has been provided. In terms of special schools, seven new ones have been established in recent years in a number of areas, including Cork and Dublin. In the 2024-25 school year, the focus is on areas outside the larger cities. New special schools will open in counties Meath, Kildare, Wexford and Limerick. My own county of Monaghan does not have a special school and the same is true of County Leitrim. These are the areas we will have to look at in terms of providing more special needs schools. Capacity in the special schools around the country will also be increased, as has happened in recent years.

The Department of Education and the NCSE work closely on the forward planning of special school provision. Since 2020, a total of 55 building projects have been completed across 41 special schools. During 2022 and 2023 alone, the school building programme provided accommodation for 80 additional or modernised classrooms in special schools. We have all seen them in our own constituencies. They are state-of-the-art and are providing a great service but there are many cases where such classes are not suitable for children who need to be in a special school. I accept that and what is best for the children is what we are focused on.

Yesterday, we welcomed some members of the families of the 27 victims of the Dublin bombing and the seven who lost their lives in Monaghan, along with representatives of the Justice for the Forgotten group, to the Dáil for the debate on Sinn Féin's motion for the 50th anniversary of the Dublin and Monaghan bombings. I welcomed that motion and the families welcomed the fact that the Government also supported it. However, one thing the motion failed to address is the fact that the families of the victims of those two horrific acts have never had the Garda files released to them or their legal teams. The motion referred to material from Operation Denton but a number of TDs raised issues of concern yesterday. The Garda investigation was famously inadequate and the State's response was callous and uncaring. The investigation was closed after ten weeks. Files relating to the investigation were lost or destroyed. The Barron commission criticised the investigation for ending too soon. Forensic evidence was mishandled. Evidence and files that should have been sent North after 24 hours were not sent for 11 days and then went missing.

Garda forensic technical expert, James Donovan, who was sent some material to test by the Garda, was not made aware that the material went North for 25 years. The forensics team in Dublin did not work in co-operation with its counterparts in Belfast. Not one survivor or bereaved family member was interviewed by the Garda in Dublin or Monaghan after the atrocity or to date. After 50 years, no policeman knocked on their doors. Jon Boutcher, who initially headed up Operation Denton, was the first policeman to knock on people's doors as part of his inquiry.

Bertie Ahern, when he was Taoiseach, said there was nothing in the files that would have suggested or indicated who was responsible. If the files are so clean of evidence, why have they not been released to the families? They should be released now. There have been 29 Ministers for Justice since the atrocity. None has been willing to release Garda files to the families' legal teams. Two of them, Nora Owen and Máire Geoghegan-Quinn, told the families at meetings that they should go and find their information and, if they found something, to come back to them. The investigative material presented to the McEntee inquiry has been blocked to the families' legal teams by the Government under the Commissions of Investigation Act 2004. This will stop family members and their legal teams from seeing the material for 50 years. I call on the Minister, as do the families, to release these materials immediately to the families and their legal teams.

This investigation was mishandled by the Garda. The aftermath, including the grief of the victims and their families, was mishandled by the State. The Tánaiste acknowledged that last night. The families want to see the investigation files but they still have not been allowed to do so. They will have to wait decades until the Commissions of Investigation Act no longer applies. Will the Government commit to releasing immediately the Garda files and the investigation materials to the victims, their families and their legal teams? If the Government gets its own house in order, we can go to the British state and ask it to get its house in order.

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. We commemorate the 50th anniversary of the Dublin and Monaghan bombings this Friday. The legacy of that atrocity lives on in the memory of many. In my own town of Monaghan, I know how it impacted on people. I acknowledge the people who lost their lives that day. The bomb in Monaghan went off outside Greacen's pub. I was just reading about two children whose father dropped them to a hall that day while he went into Greacen's pub. When the bomb went off, the children were taken home in the panic. Later, the news came that their father had been badly injured in the bombing. This event happened 50 years ago but its legacy lives on.

The Government has supported all-party Dáil motions on the Dublin and Monaghan bombings. There has been agreement right across the House on those motions. The matter continues to be a priority for the Government. The Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs has consistently raised the previous motions with the British Government, most recently with the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on 18 and 29 April. He will continue to do so. We discussed the issue at the Cabinet yesterday. There is agreement on it right across the House.

I cannot give the Deputy a commitment regarding the Garda files. However, I give her a commitment that I will raise the matter with the relevant Minister and the Tánaiste to see whether any further progress can be made.

Last night, the Tánaiste said in this House:

Today, we mourn with [the families] the great loss suffered by the victims of the bombs of 17 May 1974. We offer our humble acknowledgement of the obstacles [they] have overcome and the mountain [they] have climbed to get your campaign to where it is today. We recognise our own past shortcomings as a State and political system.

On this 50th anniversary commemoration, we have to recognise that. More than anything, the families would welcome the Government stepping in and releasing the Garda files. The Minister said she would raise it with the Tánaiste. The files should be released and that should be announced as soon as possible. The information on held on files under the Commissions of Investigation Act should also be released immediately to the families. A line of communication, like the line of communication that was set up with the Stardust families, should be set up with these families in order that they and their legal teams can start asking the Government for what they need to get justice and truth. That is what they want more than anything.

Like the Deputy, I have engaged with the families of the victims of this terrible atrocity. I know some of them extremely well. It has been a long journey and a difficult time for them. As the Tánaiste said, we need to look at this issue once again and try to get access to the files. I take on board what the Deputy said.

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