Seanad Éireann debate -
Thursday, 26 Oct 2023

Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters

Business Supports

Senator Marie Sherlock

I thank the Minister of State for coming to the Chamber. My question relates to the increased cost of business scheme which was announced as part of budget 2024 by way of response to rising costs for businesses and the increase in the minimum wage. Most of us recognise employers face increased costs. I question the untargeted, once-off and exclusionary nature of the support. I understand non-rate payers will not qualify for the scheme. I would rather see the Government moving away from the once-off payments and thinking about how to support businesses and quality employment in a longer-term manner. When we spoke to Low Pay Commission officials last week, we asked them to look at longer-term support to businesses, in particular the use of the State’s procurement budget of more than €17 billion and how the might of the State can be used to support quality jobs, decent pay and businesses in our communities.

My question concerns the rates rebate within the cost of business scheme. We have not seen much detail to date. The chair of the Low Pay Commission referred to the rebate last week. What will be the arrangement with local authorities to make sure they are not out of pocket? In budget 2024, local government only received €29 million extra in funding and that was largely for increased supports to the fire service and for the directly elected mayor. When we talk to councillors, they tell us of significant needs in their local authorities for additional funding. Rates make up an important part of the revenue that local authorities generate for themselves. There is an issue with the administration of a rates rebate, the cost implicit in that and the funding shortfall that will arise for many local authorities. What arrangements will be put in place? What will be the timing of the rates rebates? What will be the scale of supports to local authorities with regard to the scheme?

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Neale Richmond)

I appreciate the opportunity to speak on this matter in the House. It is always a pleasure to come back.

As the Senator will be aware, the increased cost of business scheme is worth €250 million. Not a single cent will be required from local authorities, or indeed the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage, to administer it. The fund has been generated by the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment and will be allocated to 31 local authorities. We have decided to use the rates scheme as the most effective way to get a quick cash injection to businesses struggling with rising energy costs and the increased cost of doing business, whether it be the increase to the minimum wage, which the Senator and I both welcome and hope goes further in future, or other costs such as pension auto-enrolment and the fact we will on 1 January move from employees being entitled five rather than three days' paid sick leave. The latter is something the Senator called for and will look for us to go further on, which we will in due course.

This is a manner in which we are able to support 87% of businesses in the State, largely small and medium enterprises, SMEs, which are the businesses struggling the most. Large multinationals and large employers will not be eligible for this scheme; rather, it will be targeted at SMEs who paid rates under €20,000 last year. They will be able to get a payment of up to 50% of their rate in the first quarter of next year.

The scheme is being worked out by my Department and the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage. We have had a lot of good arrangements with it. It will be a straightforward transfer of funds that will not require arduous administration. No form-filling by businesses will be required. This will be a strict cash injection. Having spent the entirety of last year traipsing around the country meeting businesses and representative groups in shops and on factory floors, I recognise the serious costs.

I do not accept that this is exclusionary beyond the fact, about which we have been open, that we are targeting SMEs.

We are targeting those smaller businesses that are most exposed to any increased costs in doing business, either as a cause of Government policy or wider global economic pressures. We have used the rates system. This is not a rates recalculation or rates rebate. We have used the system available to us to deliver the quickest and least administratively complicated system to get a fund in place for businesses as quickly as possible.

The budget only comes live on 1 January.

When we talk about longer term support, the most important support that any Government can give to any business is to create an economic environment that allows businesses to thrive. The Senator will recognise that we have one of the strongest economies in the European Union. As recession clouds gather across the Continent, we will consistently see job growth and new small and large businesses being set up. We will attract foreign direct investment and we will see an economy that is supporting and backing business. It is not always just the State's job to provide financial assistance to businesses. We recognise that smaller businesses have extreme costs that merit state intervention for SMEs. That is what we are doing with this fund. The policy of the Government and my party since we came in to office in 2011 with the Senator's party has been to get the economy up and running, which we have done. There have been 780,000 jobs created since 2011. The Senator's party played a proud part in that during very difficult years. That is, first and foremost, how we are going to support businesses during tough times. It is not always just about State contracts, although that area is always being looked at as well.

Senator Marie Sherlock

On the Minister of State's last comment, I hope he is looking at State contracts. We have an endemic problem with low pay in Ireland. If we are serious about ever changing that, we need to look at how the might of the State and the State procurement budget of more than €17 billion is used.

I very much welcome that this scheme is not going to cost the local authorities a penny. The Minister of State's predecessors will have heard many of us talk, during the height of the pandemic, about the exclusionary nature of some of the Covid supports when they were targeted at ratepayers. I am thinking in particular of two events caterers who operate out of Dublin 9. In the middle of the pandemic, they asked me why every other small business was getting support when they were being excluded because they were operating out of a non-rateable premises. They were decimated during the pandemic because their business dried up. It is a mistake to be exclusionary. The Minister of State referred to 87% of businesses but the other 13% of businesses, many of them small, are trying to get up off the ground and unfortunately they are excluded from the scheme.

Deputy Neale Richmond

We have looked at the data and the vast majority of the 13% of businesses are large multinationals making large profits. The scheme is targeted at small and medium enterprises, most of which have greater exposure for a number of reasons. These include the fact that they are commercial ratepayers and there has been a rate revaluation in the past couple of years in pretty much every local authority, increased energy costs and increased interest rates on properties they have purchased or are leasing from landlords.

To refer again the pandemic, we cannot let the perfect be the enemy of the good. This is a good scheme which will benefit 87% of businesses at a time of difficulty. It will mean no administrative burden or forms to fill out and will provide a direct cash injection to make sure they have some respite in the first quarter of next year. It will allow local authorities to use the rates system to pay back rather than just take. This is a good news story and I look forward to seeing it supported through the finance Bill in the Houses.

Housing Provision

Senator Mary Fitzpatrick

I am seeking an update on the regeneration of flats on the west side of Dominick Street, one of the oldest streets in the capital. It runs from Parnell Street up to Dorset Street and has been home to the Dominick Street flats for many decades. In 2008, Dublin City Council first spoke about the regeneration of the flats. It took the council far too long but, thankfully, in the last 12 months we have seen 72 new, world-class homes being built. They have world-class design standards and quality. This is a very welcome development and I congratulate Dublin City Council, the architects, the builders and everybody else involved in the project.

As I said, the regeneration of Dominick Street was first talked about in 2008. We are now in 2023. Since the new homes were opened on the east side of Dominick Street, the old flats which were vacated on the west side of the street became a destination for antisocial behaviour. I commend the gardai in the north inner city and Dublin City Council for engaging with me, residents and business owners and taking direct action to tackle and eliminate this behaviour. The flats have been boarded up and secured. While I would hesitate to say that all antisocial behaviour has been eliminated, it certainly has been greatly reduced and that is very welcome.

The flats, which have the potential to provide more than 90 homes, are now boarded up and stand as a monument to inactivity and glacial progress. I hope the Minister of State has a positive update for the House and, more important, the city. I hope Dublin City Council is taking direct action to use the incredibly valuable assets it holds in ownership for the people on Dominick Street and its plans to renovate those boarded-up flats is on track and will be delivering homes very soon in the centre of our capital city.

Deputy Neale Richmond

I appreciate the Senator raising this topic. It is an issue in an area that the Senator has been such a passionate advocate for, not just in this House, but previously on Dublin City Council as well. That deserves recognition. Dublin City Council has advised the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage that it is currently preparing a stage 1 capital appraisal application for the refurbishment and regeneration of Dominick Street West. This application will be for the redevelopment of the three existing vacant blocks, with the potential for at least 75 new homes.

The project involves the remediation of 60 upper floor duplexes and the amalgamation of 30 ground floor bedsits which have been unoccupied and boarded up for some time. The Senator has been very polite in her clarification of that. I would be far stronger. I think boarded-up houses are a blight on society because they show where families could be living. It does not matter whether it is on Dominick Street, in Ballyogan in my constituency or in Dundalk in the Chair's constituency, it is something that all of us take very personally.

The Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage has not received a funding submission yet but would welcome all proposals on this project. The council has advised the Department that it is intended that what was learned from a recent digital twin study project funded by the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform will help inform the energy approach for this project. The design team will also be seeking to achieve a balanced approach on biodiversity, retrofit and climate actions requirements.

This project is intended to act as a Dublin City Council flagship project for climate resilience. Extensive surveys and site investigations are under way on the vacant flats and these building and site surveys will shape the vision and direction of the project. Current works on the site will include securing the car park to the rear of Dominick Street Lower, which the Senator referred to regarding anti-social behaviour, the erection of permanent hoarding to the front of the flats and a greening project in the vacant car park.

Dublin City Council advises that the feasibility study and order of magnitude costings for a deep retrofit approach have been completed and the stage 1 capital appraisal is almost complete. Consultant procurement and technical surveys are ongoing. The programme timeline is not finalised as the project is at feasibility stage. However, Dublin City Council advises that it expects to have a contractor on site by the first quarter of 2026. The council further advises that this project is part of a long-term strategy for the redevelopment and refurbishment of its older complexes that require prompt attention.

I think all of us would be in agreement that this is an important project. We will ensure the Department is on hand to give Dublin City Council every support, as will every Member of the Oireachtas, to get these vacant flats renovated and repurposed and back into the system. We want to provide the level of accommodation that the people of Dominick Street and people who will live there in the future deserve.

Senator Mary Fitzpatrick

I appreciate the Minister of State's reply. The positive news is that Dublin City Council and the Department recognise the potential for 75 new homes of the highest standard and highest quality right in the heart of our city.

I find it hard to accept that the timeline will result in a contractor not arriving on site before the first quarter of 2026. I appreciate the lofty ambitions in the digital twin study and the idea of creating a flagship project for climate resilience; these objectives are very admirable. However, I wonder at the time being spent developing bespoke and lofty proposals like this as there is a real urgency. I do not understand what has taken the feasibility study so long or why this work was not being done in parallel with the construction of new properties on the east side of the street. As the Minister of State, the misuse or under-use of built homes is vandalism and a complete dereliction of duty. I ask him to write to Dublin City Council to ask if it can accelerate the project.

Deputy Neale Richmond

I share the Senator's disappointment to some extent. I will undertake to ask my colleague in the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage to write to Dublin City Council. Realistically, it is appropriate for him to write than me. I will act as a conduit because I share the Senator's ambition for this part of the city. The capital is my home too and I know how dedicated she has been to the project for a long time. We all know that a large number of these flat complexes will, effectively, be rebuilt. The biggest priority is using them for housing for people who need homes. I will undertake to speak to the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, and the Minister of State, Deputy O'Donnell, and have that correspondence sent to Dublin City Council.

Schools Building Projects

Senator Tim Lombard

I raise the issue of Summercove National School. The Minister of State is very much aware that Summercove is a school in Kinsale that needs a little extra attention to make sure it reaches its full potential regarding a new building. This is an issue on which Councillor Marie O'Sullivan and I have been working for a long time to make sure we could deliver this new building. There has been significant movement in school complexes in Kinsale over the past few years. Last Friday morning, I attended the ten-year anniversary of Scoil Naomh Eltin's opening, I was at the gaelscoil, which is moving forward, and there is movement in St. Multose National School. There has been significant movement in Ballinspittle, Rennies, Belgooly and Kilbrittain national schools over the past few years. Summercove National School now needs support. It has been looking for movement for decades; there was an issue about a site for a long time, there was a previous planning application that did not quite work out, not to go around the circles again. Now, the site issue has been sorted. The site has been purchased, subject to planning permission. It is a new site and a new build literally across the road from where the school is at the moment. Kinsale is a thriving town. According to the census figures, it went up 13.5% in the last census, which is significant growth. Kinsale is bordering nearly 6,000 people; it is the second-biggest town in south west Cork. The good work at the school needs progress regarding the school itself. I compliment the principal, Louise Hallissey and her staff of 18. There are three special education teachers, five assistants and the secretaries - two wonderful ladies who run the school. There are also 217 pupils. These boys and girls want movement on this important project. I raised this issue previously in the Oireachtas in October 2021 and I got the indication that it was moving forward, the site had been purchased and was going to planning permission stage. We now need more movement in that regard. I am aware that these things take time and there are six parts to the planning process to build a school. I am concerned that we could be waiting another three or four years for the school to be built on-site.

Will the Minister of State explain where we are in the process at the moment, planning permission and a timeline of when it can move forward and boots will be on the ground for this project, which is important for the people of Kinsale? I compliment the amount of work done by the local parish priest and the entire community. They have been proactive. I know they met with the former Minister of State, Jim Daly, on this matter. He met the Minister at that time, Deputy Joe McHugh, to push this project forward. It is now about trying to push it forward another bit to see movement on the ground.

Deputy Neale Richmond

I thank the Senator for submitting this Commencement matter and giving me the opportunity to update the House on the progress of the new building for Summercove National School in the beautiful town of Kinsale. One does not need to rely on Central Statistics Office, CSO, figures; one can see the sheer activity around Kinsale. We know the population has gone up but the future population will grow exponentially. Anyone who has spent time travelling to that part of the country will have seen the rate of development in new housing developments and renovations. When the Senator brought me there just before Easter weekend in April with Councillor Marie O'Sullivan, we discussed many issues relevant to business. A key issue mentioned by many business owners was that when bringing jobs and attracting business to the town, we have to make sure there are schools for the children of the people we want to attract to this amazing town. Central to that is the development of a new school for Summercove National School.

As the Senator will be aware, the brief for this project is the development of a single-storey, eight-classroom primary school with two classrooms for pupils with special educational needs, SEN. The school recently requested a review of its long-term accommodation requirements. The Department has completed this review and is satisfied that the accommodation to be provided for eight mainstream classrooms and two SEN classrooms will cater for the long-term needs of the school and the wider Kinsale area. The major building project for the national school will be delivered under the Department's accelerated delivery of architectural planning and tendering, ADAPT, programme. The programme uses a professional external project manager to co-ordinate and drive the design team to achieve the best-possible timeframe for the project through the stages of architectural planning to tender and construction. The tender process to appoint a project manager was completed in the first quarter of this year. The tender process to appoint the design team to progress the project for Summercove National School was completed in the second quarter of 2023. The design team is currently at an early stage of architectural planning - stage one, preliminary design - in which the design team carries out an assessment of the site and location and prepares initial sketch schemes. On receipt and review of the stage one report, the end of stage one stakeholders' meeting will be arranged by the project manager, to include representatives from the school, the design team and departmental officials. The Senator asked for an update on progress; progress has been made but I am sure the Senator shares my desire to see that progress continued and sped up, where possible.

Senator Tim Lombard

I thank the Minister of State for his response. I acknowledge that there has been progress since I last put down the Commencement matter, which is helpful. It is a positive statement for the principal, the chair of the board of management and the 217 kids going to the school. We now need timelines. Perhaps the Minister of State could go back to the Department and give an indication of the timeline and when, where and how this will be delivered on the ground. It is important that the design team carries out this assessment on the site. I assume that is now moving towards planning permission stage and will then go through the other phases. If we got an indication from the Department, in due course, regarding the timeline and when this project could be finished, it would be helpful to the entire community of Kinsale. I thank the Chair.

Deputy Neale Richmond

The Department and project manager will keep school authorities and all relevant bodies informed of further development regarding the completion of stage one and the progression of the major building project. Until the project is at a point at which all statutory approvals have been granted, however, it is not possible to provide an update on the expected on-site date. I will undertake to liaise with the Minister for Education, Deputy Foley, and the Minister of State at the Department of Education, Deputy Madigan, in this regard. I encourage the Senator to write to them directly, as I am sure he has. We will make sure to keep the entire community of Kinsale - the church and school communities, parents, prospective parents, businesses and local representatives like the Senator and Councillor O'Sullivan updated as clearly as possible and that there is a collective effort to drive this as quickly as possible. I am sure we will deliver that.

Hospital Overcrowding

Senator Paul Gavan

It is always nice to see the Minister of State but I have to be honest, I am more than disappointed that, once again, the Minister for Health has decided not to turn up. I do not know if the Minister of State is familiar with the Coen brothers movie of 2001, "The Man Who Wasn't There". It is a great movie - the Coen brothers always deliver. Perhaps they should write a sequel, "The Minister Who Wasn't There." Frankly, I can only assume it is because of embarrassment that he has, for the second time now, declined to come to the House for a Commencement matter to talk about University Hospital Limerick, UHL. Equally, I have to share with the Minister of State that my colleague, Deputy Quinlivan, is having exactly the same experience regarding Topical Issues.

It is particularly disappointing this week because, as the Minister of State may know, a new record was set with 130 patients on trolleys last Monday. Just when we thought it could not possibly get any worse, it continues to do so. I do not know whether he has seen the video posted by the Sunday World of the emergency department. We can see patients stacked up in the corridors, one on top of another, right the way through, outside the emergency department and inside. We can see doctors and nurses frantically trying to calm down patients who are in obvious distress because of the fact they are completely stranded without a bed.

The record of the Government is, frankly, appalling with regard to the failures at UHL. There is a record of 12 years of Fine Gael failure in government with regard to UHL. I assure the Minister of State that the people of Limerick will not forget this. It beggars belief as we head into another winter that we are said to have worse figures again this year. Last year. 18,000 patients were on trolleys at UHL. We are already set to beat that appalling record this year. In October, as of last Monday, there have been 1,632 patients on trolleys. The same time last year there had been just over 1,200. There has been a 30% increase on patients on trolleys.

The Minister of State will really appreciate that the trouble with figures is that they do not give any insight into the pain, distress and lost lives. We know from research conducted in the UK that for every 82 patients on trolleys for more than eight hours, there is one death. We can take it from this that each day, at least one life is being lost unnecessarily in UHL. This week there was a telling interview with the INMO official, Mary Fogarty. In exasperation, she called for a halt to all elective procedures because of the impossible conditions that her members, the nurses, are put under at UHL. The same extends to healthcare assistants, porters and all of the other vital staff in the hospital.

This is compounded by the fact that the Minister for Health was thrown under the bus by the Minister for Finance just two weeks ago in the budget, with a large deficit for the health system and a freeze on recruitment. As healthcare assistants decide to leave UHL, they will not be able to be replaced. I know some of them who have left because of the appalling conditions there. How on earth will we get through this winter? Last winter the system entirely collapsed. Shannondoc collapsed and the whole system collapsed. I was going to ask the Minister for Health, and I hope the Minister of State will have some answers on his behalf this morning, what particular interactions is he planning to make sure we do not have a repeat of this crisis as we head into another winter.

I remind the Minister of State that we have been told by the HSE that the 96-bed unit promised to be delivered next year will not be ready until 2025. This will only deliver an additional 48 beds because 48 existing beds will be phased out. Even when we have this unit, which is at least two winters away, there will still be a large deficit in beds. We are 200 beds short. This is a failure of planning and a failure of capacity. It is always at the expense of the people of Limerick. I look forward to the response from the Minister of State.

Deputy Neale Richmond

I greatly appreciate the opportunity to reply to Senator's matter. It is always good to see the Senator, regardless of the seriousness of the nature of the debate. This should be reflected.

As the Senator alluded to, the Minister for Health has been concerned for some time about the congestion experienced in the emergency department at UHL, leading to long patient experience times and patients waiting on trolleys for admission.

There were just under 80,000 attendances at the emergency department in Limerick in 2022, up 12% compared to 2019 and 13% higher than the average of 2017 to 2021. There continues to be a high level of presentations in 2023, with more than 59,000 attendances between January and September of this year. This represents a 11% increase on the same period in 2019. Crucially, the attendance figures for patients aged 75 or over has increased by 30% compared to 2019.

There has been, and continues to be, substantial investment in capacity in UHL, including the opening of an additional 98 acute inpatient beds, and a 19% increase in budget in 2022 compared to 2019. Ennis and Nenagh model 2 hospitals and St. John's model 2S hospital are also playing a key role in delivering high-quality patient care in the wider mid-west. Further funding of €5.2 million was allocated this year to medical assessment units in these three hospitals, which now operate 12 hours a day, seven days a week. These units provide earlier treatment, allowing patients to avoid the emergency department, and they ensure community referrals. In addition, the medical assessment unit pathway for 999 patients in Ennis and Nenagh hospitals has been extended to St. John’s Hospital since 4 August.

As part of last year’s national winter plan, there was a bespoke, site-level plan for Limerick. While the winter plan officially ended at the end of last winter, many of its initiatives continue to be implemented. The local plan focused on local needs and builds on integration between the community and acute hospital services. It includes measures such as the recruitment of extra staff, including, but not limited to, two whole-time equivalent emergency medicine consultants, additional emergency department registrars and discharge co-ordinators to target patient flow. The plan also includes improving access to diagnostics for urgent and emergency attendances in the emergency department and for GPs, and the enhancement of GP out-of-hours supports. The plan also includes the recruitment of administrative staff and the creation of the performance management office to drive the ongoing service improvements.

The Minister asked the HSE to develop a new approach to urgent and emergency care planning to reflect the year round demands on emergency departments, including in UHL. The approach to planning urgent and emergency care is twofold. It comprises the delivery of an operational plan for 2023, approved by Government in July, and the delivery of a three-year multi-annual plan, expected to be submitted to Government in the coming weeks. The Department of Health is working with the HSE to ensure that the operational plans are fully implemented.

I share the frustration of the Senator, as do all representatives regardless of whether they are from Limerick. The images we saw posted by the Sunday World were absolutely harrowing. I was doing my leaving certificate in 2001 and I do not remember that particular Coen Brothers movie. I do remember the video posted in recent days. It was absolutely shocking. It is a requirement for the Government to react to it and to continue to increase the level of investment.

To be quite factual with regard to many of the recruitment changes that have happened as part of the budget, no one was thrown under the bus. Throwing out such slurs does not add to the debate on serious matters such as this. Health funding was increased in the State. It is always reviewed. Many of the positions identified for additional recruitment have not yet been filled. All of these issues remain under review. At the top of the priority list for anyone is to ensure the delivery of care and support for everyone in the country, particularly those in Limerick and the wider mid-west.

Senator Paul Gavan

I thank the Minister of State. I appreciate the fact that he has gone to the best extent he can in giving me a response. I acknowledge this. I have a couple of key fundamental problems with the response. The measures taken to date are not working fully enough. Conditions continue to get worse and, in fairness, the Minister of State has acknowledged this with regard to the horrific video we have both seen.

When the Minister for Health was last in the Chamber, he was in denial about the INMO figures. This is fundamentally a massive problem. If he does not accept the INMO figures, which he was happy to accept when he was in opposition, then he really does not understand the extent of the crisis. In February, he insisted there were eight patients on trolleys when in fact the INMO figure was 78 patients on trolleys. The feeling of people in Limerick is that this is a Minister who does not understand the depth of the problem and has failed so far to get to grips with it. What I want to understand in particular is what additional steps he will take, for example, to utilise private hospitals if required to ensure the ongoing daily crisis in UHL is halted for the sake of the patients and their loved ones who, even as we speak, are struggling on trolleys again this morning.

Deputy Neale Richmond

As I mentioned, significant resources have been invested in UHL in recent years. I want to outline some of what has been invested in and is onstream. We saw an increase in the workforce in UHL of 36%, or 966 whole-time staff, at the end of 2019. Recently the Minister opened new theatre wards in clinical areas in Croom Orthopaedic Hospital. This includes the development of an ambulatory trauma service to facilitate the transfer of trauma patients from UHL for surgery and recovery, improving flow and reducing congestion.

A key part of the solution for Limerick is additional beds. Work on the new 96 single bed inpatient block commenced in September 2022. This additional bed capacity for the midwest is expected to be operational in mid-2025. Pending planning approval, the next step in the development of a second 96 bed block will continue. The Department regularly seeks assurance regarding the appropriate escalation measures for the emergency department. We have seen increased funding provided for additional GP access to diagnostics in primary care, allowing for patients to be referred directly for x-rays or scans. In the mid-west, more than 1,400 of the scans are being completed each month. These are all part of the many solutions required to address what is an extremely acute regional problem for Limerick and the mid-west.

Acting Chairperson (Senator John McGahon)

I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Richmond, for a tour de force on four Commencement matters this morning. It is really appreciated. I welcome the Austrian ambassador to Ireland, H. E., Thomas Nader, and his colleague. I thank them so much for being here. It is a great privilege to them in Seanad Éireann today and I thank them for their presence.

Cuireadh an Seanad ar fionraí ar 10.10 a.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 10.30 a.m.

Sitting suspended at 10.10 a.m. and resumed at 10.30 a.m.